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<blockquote data-quote="drnuncheon" data-source="post: 546843" data-attributes="member: 96">Actually, according to reports from the designers, they balanced the rogue figuring that he would be able to get sneak attacks most if not all of the time.&nbsp; As one of them (I think Monte?) said, given flanking, invisibility, and all the other ways you can rob someone of their dex bonus, it's just not that hard to make a sneak attack.Plus, there's a fairly sizable number of monsters that aren't affected: undead, constructs, elementals, plants, oozes, anything that's too big for you to reach the vitals on...hide in shadows all you want against the lich, it won't help you do more damage.Hmm.&nbsp; Ftr10/DD10 has a Will save of +10.&nbsp; Wiz20 has a Will save of +12.&nbsp; What am I missing?&nbsp; If he's in his defensive stance, he still only equals the wizard, not surpassing him.Plus, the DD's got to take three substandard feat choices to get into the class. Dodge normally isn't substandard because it leads up the Mobility chain, but the mobility chain doesn't work well with the DD's class abilities.&nbsp; Endurance rarely comes into play in most games that I've seen.&nbsp; And Toughness as a feat choice for a fighter is simply absurd (unless you're getting something else out of it, like entry into a PrC.)EDIT: Psion mentions: &quot;First off, a shadowdancer does not have continued sneak attack progression, and unlike true invisibility can be spotted using spot skill. No magic needed.&quot;Actually, a Spot DC 20 check lets you become aware of an active invisible creature (although it's DC40 to pinpoint it enough for an attack).&nbsp; One character in my campaign manages to roll 20+ fairly regularly.&nbsp; (Elven ftr/rog with the Blooded feat, for a total bonus of +sick.)J</blockquote>

[QUOTE="drnuncheon, post: 546843, member: 96"] Actually, according to reports from the designers, they balanced the rogue figuring that he would be able to get sneak attacks most if not all of the time. As one of them (I think Monte?) said, given flanking, invisibility, and all the other ways you can rob someone of their dex bonus, it's just not that hard to make a sneak attack. Plus, there's a fairly sizable number of monsters that aren't affected: undead, constructs, elementals, plants, oozes, anything that's too big for you to reach the vitals on...hide in shadows all you want against the lich, it won't help you do more damage. Hmm. Ftr10/DD10 has a Will save of +10. Wiz20 has a Will save of +12. What am I missing? If he's in his defensive stance, he still only equals the wizard, not surpassing him. Plus, the DD's got to take three substandard feat choices to get into the class. Dodge normally isn't substandard because it leads up the Mobility chain, but the mobility chain doesn't work well with the DD's class abilities. Endurance rarely comes into play in most games that I've seen. And Toughness as a feat choice for a fighter is simply absurd (unless you're getting something else out of it, like entry into a PrC.) EDIT: Psion mentions: "First off, a shadowdancer does not have continued sneak attack progression, and unlike true invisibility can be spotted using spot skill. No magic needed." Actually, a Spot DC 20 check lets you become aware of an active invisible creature (although it's DC40 to pinpoint it enough for an attack). One character in my campaign manages to roll 20+ fairly regularly. (Elven ftr/rog with the Blooded feat, for a total bonus of +sick.) J [/QUOTE]

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