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Message: <blockquote data-quote="painandgreed" data-source="post: 2684541" data-attributes="member: 24969">Which is counter to your experience? That players avoid combat, or that elders can be taken down with a bad role? Or both?I've found that game play is different although it takes awhile for most normal D&D players to settle in. I can remember introducing my D&D group to the game and after a few sessions it finally dawned on them that money didn't matter, unlike D&D. Plyers can start rich and even large amounts of money stop being main character motivators because the powers that even a starting character has can gain them that money fairly easily and once they have it, there's nothing really to buy with it. You can use it to gain power with mortals, but even then, starting powers are more effective than money. Divorcing the experience system from combat frees the characters of combat if they don't want it. So a character can create a social character if they want and do really well. Still, many characters and STs keep with the combat emphasis simply because that's what they understand or enjoy. Combat is a little less one sided in WoD than it is in d20. While demonstrating the combat system to a new player, I was able to beat the NPC prince of Chicago into torpor with a base begining character (although built for combat) and one round of surprise. In D&D a 1st level fighter getting a Coup de Grace plus a few more rounds of free attacks on a 15th level fighter is probably not going to be a serious threat. The thing that nerfs that are some of the higher level disciplines, especially if you make some new ones up to do just that.</blockquote>

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