Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
Playing the Game
Story Hour
Wulf's Collected Story Hour -- FINAL UPDATE 12/25
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="LightPhoenix" data-source="post: 243995" data-attributes="member: 115"><p>Except you just missed his entire point.</p><p></p><p>Improved Invis. means he has to rely on a spell, from another class, to use his ability effectively. An ability which is one of the major tenets of the class. Same deal with sneaking - if he has to rely on another person to cast spells on him to use major functions of his class, why even bother with the class?</p><p></p><p>Similar sort of thing with flanking. When it does come up, it means Wulf is right on the front lines, and an extra 1d6 damage (or is it 2d6, I forget how many Rogue levels Wulf has) at those levels isn't worth the levels put into Rogue. He'd have been better off taking levels of Ranger for the skills, and get some more fighting prowess out of it.</p><p></p><p>For the record, while Blindsight does say that creatures usually don't have to make Spot or Listen checks if you're in their range, as long as you know what kind of Blindsight they have and take measures against it, they should have to make a check. Blindsight though scent could be countered by rolling in the dirt or mud... maybe the first has them make a check with a +10 bonus, the second a normal check.</p><p></p><p>(Personal opinion)</p><p>Blindsight is a misnomer for the ability, I think. If it's just an alternative form of sight, they should still have to make checks. Hell, Dwarves don't automatically see anything within 60 feet of them when there's no light, why should something with echolocation? IMO Spot isn't just seeing stuff, it's interpretation of little things that are wrong - whether it's noticing that the bush over there just rustled and there's no wind, or there's a slight bump from the signal you received from that rock.</p><p></p><p>And on that note, why would something with scent-based Darkvision get a bonus to Listen? Maybe something with echolocation might, but something with vibration-based blindsight certainly shouldn't.</p><p></p><p>Of course, this argument is harder to make with something scent-based, but that's when you do something like I described above - don't make it a flat out success no matter what, but add a hefty bonus unless precautions are taken. A +20 bonus to a Spot check would suffice.</p><p></p><p>The more I think about this ability, the more recoculous I think it is. Maybe I'll write something up in House Rules about it.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="LightPhoenix, post: 243995, member: 115"] Except you just missed his entire point. Improved Invis. means he has to rely on a spell, from another class, to use his ability effectively. An ability which is one of the major tenets of the class. Same deal with sneaking - if he has to rely on another person to cast spells on him to use major functions of his class, why even bother with the class? Similar sort of thing with flanking. When it does come up, it means Wulf is right on the front lines, and an extra 1d6 damage (or is it 2d6, I forget how many Rogue levels Wulf has) at those levels isn't worth the levels put into Rogue. He'd have been better off taking levels of Ranger for the skills, and get some more fighting prowess out of it. For the record, while Blindsight does say that creatures usually don't have to make Spot or Listen checks if you're in their range, as long as you know what kind of Blindsight they have and take measures against it, they should have to make a check. Blindsight though scent could be countered by rolling in the dirt or mud... maybe the first has them make a check with a +10 bonus, the second a normal check. (Personal opinion) Blindsight is a misnomer for the ability, I think. If it's just an alternative form of sight, they should still have to make checks. Hell, Dwarves don't automatically see anything within 60 feet of them when there's no light, why should something with echolocation? IMO Spot isn't just seeing stuff, it's interpretation of little things that are wrong - whether it's noticing that the bush over there just rustled and there's no wind, or there's a slight bump from the signal you received from that rock. And on that note, why would something with scent-based Darkvision get a bonus to Listen? Maybe something with echolocation might, but something with vibration-based blindsight certainly shouldn't. Of course, this argument is harder to make with something scent-based, but that's when you do something like I described above - don't make it a flat out success no matter what, but add a hefty bonus unless precautions are taken. A +20 bonus to a Spot check would suffice. The more I think about this ability, the more recoculous I think it is. Maybe I'll write something up in House Rules about it. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
Playing the Game
Story Hour
Wulf's Collected Story Hour -- FINAL UPDATE 12/25
Top