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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Thanee" data-source="post: 1506961" data-attributes="member: 478">Talking about the sorcerer mainly, as they are easier to compare (spontaneous versus preparation is harder to judge).Considering, that psions don't really need metapsionics to achieve the same (or similar) results, that's really tough. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Please keep in mind, that psions have the effects of all the following metamagic feats built in their powers for free!Eschew Materials (ok, general <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />)Silent SpellStill SpellHeighten Spell4x Energy Substitution (at least in the energy range of powers)Empower and Maximize - two of the probably most powerful metamagic feats are also not that much more effective, than a standard augmented power of the same level (including the metamagic modifier, of course). Yes, damage will be lower a bit, but save DC will be higher instead, which is not too bad.Ok.So, your examples says, that the psion is ahead here, right?And that does not figure in the much higher save DC of the augmented power compared to a 3rd level spell, or does it?You are speaking of the wizard who has spent quite a few feats on metamagic, which the psion has not (see above). The same wizard, that has to decide at the morning, where to apply that metamagic, which the psion does not have to. Right?Yeah, the AoO is a notable disadvantage there, but since they don't need metapsionics, it isn't that important here (more when using Power Penetration, for example).Slight nit-pick: Wizard gets Scribe Scroll for free. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Hard to say with the wizard, really. The wizards main advantage of preparation is hard to judge against the ultimate flexibility of the psion. That's why I base my arguments on the sorcerer (and as stated elsewhere, I assume the wizard and sorcerer being roughly equal, maybe a slight advantage for the wizard - this is also based on my experience in play so far).I actually think this is not very useful, unless it is done in a plethora of very different examples.I believe that my technique of comparison - comparing the class mechanics, not single examples - is more accurate, really.Yeah, though Expanded Knowledge does lessen this quite a bit.A little? We are talking about one with Metamorphic Transfer here, or not?Can you imagine how many powerful abilities this feat alone allows to use (the Flesh to Stone thing (3/day at the cost of a single 4th level power even) is just one example)? The possibilities are almost endless considering how many monsters are out there!I don't think this comes even close... summoned monsters have some nice abilities, but they are hardly as overwhelming as what that single feat (well two, if you add in Expanded Knowledge for the power) allows.Yeah, but you have to trade equally powerful abilities to each other.ByeThanee</blockquote>

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