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yes, this again: Fighters need more non-combat options
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<blockquote data-quote="Swarmkeeper" data-source="post: 7548014" data-attributes="member: 6921763"><p>I get the desire to have more to do outside combat. And if your table wants to homebrew some add-on for fighters because that will make more fun for everyone, go for it. But I'm firmly on the side of those who think there is plenty to do for all classes outside of combat, including fighters, under the current mechanics of the game.</p><p></p><p>IMO, the PHB has everyone covered (pg 6):</p><p>[SECTION]2. The players describe what they want to do. Sometimes one player speaks for the whole party, saying, "We'll take the east door," for example. Other times, different adventurers do different things: one adventurer might search a treasure chest while a second examines an esoteric symbol engraved on a wall and a third keeps watch for monsters. The players don't need to take turns, but the DM listens to every player and decides how to resolve those actions.[/SECTION]</p><p></p><p>Ok, file that under "roleplay better" if you must, but it really is just a core part of the game. You don't need a button on the sheet to tell the DM what you'd like your PC to try. If you are discouraged because some other PC at the table has the better ability score and/or proficiency and/or class/sub-class ability for a particular task, I ask why? Optimization? If so, I submit that some of the most memorable actions in our games have been when a PC who is not the most mechanically "optimal" candidate for an action comes up with an idea, carries it out, and succeeds (or fails!) spectacularly.</p><p></p><p>Aside from all that, there is always the Help action (or whatever you'd like to call it outside combat) to aid your comrades in their non-combat tasks. Bard trying to persuade a guard to let the party through the door? Fighter stands behind him, flexing her muscles with hand on hilt of sword. Thief trying to sneak around to pilfer something from the Orc camp? Fighter causes distraction in other direction. Ranger trying to get up higher to scout the surrounding terrain? Fighter gives "ten" to get Ranger up to previously unreachable branches on highest tree in the grove. Etc...</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Swarmkeeper, post: 7548014, member: 6921763"] I get the desire to have more to do outside combat. And if your table wants to homebrew some add-on for fighters because that will make more fun for everyone, go for it. But I'm firmly on the side of those who think there is plenty to do for all classes outside of combat, including fighters, under the current mechanics of the game. IMO, the PHB has everyone covered (pg 6): [SECTION]2. The players describe what they want to do. Sometimes one player speaks for the whole party, saying, "We'll take the east door," for example. Other times, different adventurers do different things: one adventurer might search a treasure chest while a second examines an esoteric symbol engraved on a wall and a third keeps watch for monsters. The players don't need to take turns, but the DM listens to every player and decides how to resolve those actions.[/SECTION] Ok, file that under "roleplay better" if you must, but it really is just a core part of the game. You don't need a button on the sheet to tell the DM what you'd like your PC to try. If you are discouraged because some other PC at the table has the better ability score and/or proficiency and/or class/sub-class ability for a particular task, I ask why? Optimization? If so, I submit that some of the most memorable actions in our games have been when a PC who is not the most mechanically "optimal" candidate for an action comes up with an idea, carries it out, and succeeds (or fails!) spectacularly. Aside from all that, there is always the Help action (or whatever you'd like to call it outside combat) to aid your comrades in their non-combat tasks. Bard trying to persuade a guard to let the party through the door? Fighter stands behind him, flexing her muscles with hand on hilt of sword. Thief trying to sneak around to pilfer something from the Orc camp? Fighter causes distraction in other direction. Ranger trying to get up higher to scout the surrounding terrain? Fighter gives "ten" to get Ranger up to previously unreachable branches on highest tree in the grove. Etc... [/QUOTE]
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yes, this again: Fighters need more non-combat options
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