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<blockquote data-quote="Jester David" data-source="post: 5998107" data-attributes="member: 37579"><p>Okay, you're pretty wrong here.</p><p></p><p>First off, your argument is fundamentally flawed. You're arguing that older editions were vague and thus rule vagueness is old. Or put another way:</p><p>Prior editions were vague.</p><p>Prior editions are outdated.</p><p>Therefore vague rules are outdated.</p><p>That's logically unsound. A is B, A is C, therefor B is C.</p><p></p><p>Moving on to specifics, you have two main "facts" for your argument. First, that older editions had vague rules. Second, that you cannot go backwards.</p><p></p><p>The vagueness of older rules is debatable. OD&D was vague but 1e had many very, very specific rules. Meanwhile, Basic D&D (which was published concurrently with 1e-2e) had much more vague rules. </p><p>Furthermore, there are a number of very modern games that have vague rules, or rules left open to DM interpretation or ruling. The ENnie award winning Marvel RPG is a crunchy yet vague rule system, left open to creative ideas and improvisation. I can think of far more modern games that are "vague" than crunchy, and even 4e was simplified compared to 3e. </p><p></p><p><strong>The vagueness or specificity of a game system's rules are independent of the game's age.</strong></p><p></p><p>Moving on to "you cannot go back". This is highly debatable given the existence of retroclones, let alone their prevalence. There are new clones every year, such as the recently released <em>Dungeon Crawl Classics</em> game. Watch for it in next year's ENies. And if you count Pathfinder as a retroclone, they're arguably more successful than the modern game.</p><p>Many other media revel in going back. Movies and TV shows have remakes or revivals. Video games try to emulate the feel of older games (look at recent Mario games for an example). Franchises regularly reboot or attempt to go back to basics, recapturing some of the feel that had faded. The Batman and Bond films are great examples.</p><p>Recreating happenstance is hard, but not impossible. Something being hard is not a reason to give up. </p><p></p><p><strong>Going "back to basics" is a tried and true strategy. And while not a guaranteed success it can and has worked before.</strong></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jester David, post: 5998107, member: 37579"] Okay, you're pretty wrong here. First off, your argument is fundamentally flawed. You're arguing that older editions were vague and thus rule vagueness is old. Or put another way: Prior editions were vague. Prior editions are outdated. Therefore vague rules are outdated. That's logically unsound. A is B, A is C, therefor B is C. Moving on to specifics, you have two main "facts" for your argument. First, that older editions had vague rules. Second, that you cannot go backwards. The vagueness of older rules is debatable. OD&D was vague but 1e had many very, very specific rules. Meanwhile, Basic D&D (which was published concurrently with 1e-2e) had much more vague rules. Furthermore, there are a number of very modern games that have vague rules, or rules left open to DM interpretation or ruling. The ENnie award winning Marvel RPG is a crunchy yet vague rule system, left open to creative ideas and improvisation. I can think of far more modern games that are "vague" than crunchy, and even 4e was simplified compared to 3e. [B]The vagueness or specificity of a game system's rules are independent of the game's age.[/B] Moving on to "you cannot go back". This is highly debatable given the existence of retroclones, let alone their prevalence. There are new clones every year, such as the recently released [I]Dungeon Crawl Classics[/I] game. Watch for it in next year's ENies. And if you count Pathfinder as a retroclone, they're arguably more successful than the modern game. Many other media revel in going back. Movies and TV shows have remakes or revivals. Video games try to emulate the feel of older games (look at recent Mario games for an example). Franchises regularly reboot or attempt to go back to basics, recapturing some of the feel that had faded. The Batman and Bond films are great examples. Recreating happenstance is hard, but not impossible. Something being hard is not a reason to give up. [B]Going "back to basics" is a tried and true strategy. And while not a guaranteed success it can and has worked before.[/B] [/QUOTE]
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