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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jhaelen" data-source="post: 5253287" data-attributes="member: 46713">Well, I suppose you are right. However, I've been apparently quite lucky to never have met players that are like this:Note, that my group includes several players that are best described as casual players. They don't care about optimization at all and don't particularly enjoy reading about rules. But despite of this, they enjoy being challenged and are more than willing to learn about using better tactics. There are rules I have to explain to them every single session, but their tactics have definitely improved a lot since we started playing. And if an encounter runs smoothly for them these days, they get a sense of achievement, because they know I will not scale back encounters or fudge die rolls to make things easier for them. If an encounter seems easy, it's because they played well. And if they 'win' an encounter by avoiding combat altogether, it's because they roleplayed well.Anyway, as I said in the beginning, you're probably right that there are players that don't enjoy being challenged. I'm wondering though, why they're playing D&D then? Probably they'd enjoy playing a different rpg more. One with less focus on tactical combats.</blockquote>