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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Greenfield" data-source="post: 6089449" data-attributes="member: 6669384">Okay, let me throw an example I've mentioned before:  It was late in the game session and we'd wasted a lot of time because of a very badly drawn overland map.  We (the players) were tired.We have to enter and reduce a fortified structure.  The Bard (my character) approached the front gate under Greater Invisibility, laid a hand on it and used G'Elsewhere Chant.  For those unfamiliar with the spell, it teleports a creature or object 10 D10 feet in a random direction, guaranteed to land safely.  People get a Will save, unattended objects don't.  The spell fails to set any size limit on "object".The DM was unhappy, since he had a lot of prepared trouble for the group for when they tried to go over the wall.  He said that the gate was "attended" (not unreasonable that someone could be holding onto it, in a world where magic exists), but the guy failed the Save and the front gate of his castle vanished.There are a couple of different spells with limits on "object", some by weight per caster level, some limited based on what the character can lift.  Some have a straight, fixed limit (Mage Hand, for example.)  Some even have limits based on volume (Shrink Item comes to mind).  Invisibility limits by length, if the item is carried when the spell is cast, or by whether the object can be hidden beneath (invisible) clothing, if the item is picked up once the spell is in effect.  This spell doesn't list a limit, or even hint at one.My character got a disfiguring curse for offending the spirit of the rules.I wasn't trying to be a jerk.  I was trying to make an intimidating display of power for the people inside, hoping to force at least some of the people to surrender, hoping to shorten (read "end") what had been a very long and frustrating adventure.  (That DM really needs to learn that two squiggle lines drawn, small scale, on the map right in front of him do not communicate well that the castle is on a peninsula backed against the sea, with a swamp flanking the approach and a moat.  Particularly when previously the place had been inland with hills visible behind it, and a broad road that lead across an open field towards the gate.)But for whatever reason he wasn't prepared for that particular use of the spell, or for such an abrupt breach in his defenses.Now, with all of that being said, how would you have taken a surprise like that?</blockquote>

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