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<blockquote data-quote="N'raac" data-source="post: 6123632" data-attributes="member: 6681948"><p>The last seems to better sum it up. If you are not interested, then the scenario is not interesting to you.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think the GM and the players also need some ability to predict the flow of the game. If I have to worry aboout a player randomly (to me, at least) deciding that some aspect of the game is an issue for them, so "skip it"is the only option, that's one more issue to deal with as the game progresses. Multiply that by all the players in a group and it can be problematic.</p><p></p><p>As I believe I said very early in the thread, we only see the one or two examples provided, not what proportion of the game this might make up. We can only extrapolate from "this seems like a pretty common and standard event you are demanding be skipped" and from much other discussion that indicates "the only acceptable resolution is that the skip it request be immediately and unquestioningly honoured" to conclude "it seems this would be pretty common" and "this permits any one player to assert unilateral, arbitrary control over the game".</p><p></p><p>My random thoughts of curiosity - when you headed back to the city to hire mercenaries to help fight the Grell, would a siege of the city have been acceptable (that immediate "hire merc's" goal being in the city) or a roadblock? It's certainly a complication to hiring merc's - I would expect able bodied warriors for hire to be in short supply inside a city under siege, and adding 6 more people makes Teleport less likely to be a viable means of departure (assuming you had access to a teleport).</p><p></p><p> - is a "siege" of the city in the desert by the desert nomads, who don't just mass up and suround the city, but instead attempt to deter, harrass or kill anyone travelling to or from the city (a siege being very much a blockade, so avoiding retaliation is a goal of the besiegers), or does that lack of geographic proximity and/or the fact that the PCs/players do not immediately know this is why the nomads are bothering them make this an unacceptable complication?</p><p></p><p>As we discuss the initial situation, I question whether the original issue isn't coloured by your general distaste for the adventure path model, the lack of warning as to what would happen next (or ability to influence it), etc. than simply by the prospect of travel through the desert.</p><p></p><p>BTW, I'm not sure I buy into your "you can have Teleport for 3 months toil in Gehenna or walk through the desert" choice. Is it also OK if that's 3 years toil? 30 years toil? If there are dangers in that toil that either get played out or we roll to see what, if any, harm comes to the characters? How about "you can travel through the desert or each lose three levels/each lose your right arm/each need a DC 23 FORT/REF/WILL save per time period of toil (say three dificult saves each) or suffer permanent ability loss/etc."? Or should the cost be trivial (at least to the players - I find it hard to envision a 'real' group of hardy adventurers agreeing to 3 months' toil in a hellpit for a teleport scroll)?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="N'raac, post: 6123632, member: 6681948"] The last seems to better sum it up. If you are not interested, then the scenario is not interesting to you. I think the GM and the players also need some ability to predict the flow of the game. If I have to worry aboout a player randomly (to me, at least) deciding that some aspect of the game is an issue for them, so "skip it"is the only option, that's one more issue to deal with as the game progresses. Multiply that by all the players in a group and it can be problematic. As I believe I said very early in the thread, we only see the one or two examples provided, not what proportion of the game this might make up. We can only extrapolate from "this seems like a pretty common and standard event you are demanding be skipped" and from much other discussion that indicates "the only acceptable resolution is that the skip it request be immediately and unquestioningly honoured" to conclude "it seems this would be pretty common" and "this permits any one player to assert unilateral, arbitrary control over the game". My random thoughts of curiosity - when you headed back to the city to hire mercenaries to help fight the Grell, would a siege of the city have been acceptable (that immediate "hire merc's" goal being in the city) or a roadblock? It's certainly a complication to hiring merc's - I would expect able bodied warriors for hire to be in short supply inside a city under siege, and adding 6 more people makes Teleport less likely to be a viable means of departure (assuming you had access to a teleport). - is a "siege" of the city in the desert by the desert nomads, who don't just mass up and suround the city, but instead attempt to deter, harrass or kill anyone travelling to or from the city (a siege being very much a blockade, so avoiding retaliation is a goal of the besiegers), or does that lack of geographic proximity and/or the fact that the PCs/players do not immediately know this is why the nomads are bothering them make this an unacceptable complication? As we discuss the initial situation, I question whether the original issue isn't coloured by your general distaste for the adventure path model, the lack of warning as to what would happen next (or ability to influence it), etc. than simply by the prospect of travel through the desert. BTW, I'm not sure I buy into your "you can have Teleport for 3 months toil in Gehenna or walk through the desert" choice. Is it also OK if that's 3 years toil? 30 years toil? If there are dangers in that toil that either get played out or we roll to see what, if any, harm comes to the characters? How about "you can travel through the desert or each lose three levels/each lose your right arm/each need a DC 23 FORT/REF/WILL save per time period of toil (say three dificult saves each) or suffer permanent ability loss/etc."? Or should the cost be trivial (at least to the players - I find it hard to envision a 'real' group of hardy adventurers agreeing to 3 months' toil in a hellpit for a teleport scroll)? [/QUOTE]
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