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<blockquote data-quote="Razz" data-source="post: 3230995" data-attributes="member: 3014">The thing is I run epic games, and there are people that do believe it or not, and so having an Altraloth or a Baernoloth as a BBEG is right up my campaign's alley. Just because a creature is said to be super-powerful doesn't mean WotC should restrict you from ever presenting them as the BBEG. If you wanted them as one, the stats should be provided as a &quot;just in case&quot; measure. I know people complain about that being bad because then you turn such unique creatures into pickings for players. But after the 10th red great wyrm that aspires to be a deity or destroy the world, the players are looking for something interesting to tackle. Battling the minions in that yugoloth tower in Gehenna (Kin-something, forgot the name) and facing the General of Gehenna is something the &quot;stars of the game&quot; should accomplish if they want to or if the DM wants to.Besides, why play heroic characters when you throw something in their face and say &quot;they can never be stopped, because there's no stats for them, so I can't have you fight it anyway.&quot; SOMETHING has to stop them and in a D&amp;D game that should fall to the players if they choose.Sure, you can drag a campaign and have the players stop the machinations of Demogorgon for the umpteenth time and destroy like a million of his aspects...but then it gets to the point where the players go,&quot;Dude, why don't we end this whole cat&amp;mouse game and just kill the Prince of Demons himself?&quot;. And you can't blame them for eventually coming to a decision like that. Luckily, we have Demogorgon stats just for that situation.&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue&nbsp; &nbsp; :p"&nbsp; data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /></blockquote>

[QUOTE="Razz, post: 3230995, member: 3014"] The thing is I run epic games, and there are people that do believe it or not, and so having an Altraloth or a Baernoloth as a BBEG is right up my campaign's alley. Just because a creature is said to be super-powerful doesn't mean WotC should restrict you from ever presenting them as the BBEG. If you wanted them as one, the stats should be provided as a "just in case" measure. I know people complain about that being bad because then you turn such unique creatures into pickings for players. But after the 10th red great wyrm that aspires to be a deity or destroy the world, the players are looking for something interesting to tackle. Battling the minions in that yugoloth tower in Gehenna (Kin-something, forgot the name) and facing the General of Gehenna is something the "stars of the game" should accomplish if they want to or if the DM wants to. Besides, why play heroic characters when you throw something in their face and say "they can never be stopped, because there's no stats for them, so I can't have you fight it anyway." SOMETHING has to stop them and in a D&D game that should fall to the players if they choose. Sure, you can drag a campaign and have the players stop the machinations of Demogorgon for the umpteenth time and destroy like a million of his aspects...but then it gets to the point where the players go,"Dude, why don't we end this whole cat&mouse game and just kill the Prince of Demons himself?". And you can't blame them for eventually coming to a decision like that. Luckily, we have Demogorgon stats just for that situation. :p [/QUOTE]

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