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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Razz" data-source="post: 3234542" data-attributes="member: 3014">Well then what if you have PCs that leave, level up, and come back 20 levels later to face it? I'm sorry, but I have yet to see a logical reason why the stars of the game simply CAN'T defeat something uber-evil (or uber-good, if you're playing the bad guys). I'm not saying MY games are run like that, but my players tend to take after japanese anime and movies like FFVII: Advent Children and DBZ, Naruto, BLEACH, X, Samurai Deeper Kyo, etc. and pretty much WANT to do uber-stuff and feel uber. They are great RPers, so don't assume they're playing D&D like a video game, because they get very involved with story, background, and plot. It's just my group appeals to a more 100-ft. radius fireball slinging types as opposed to 20-ft. radius, if you get my meaning.So, yeah, the official stats of a powerful being via Epic Level Handbook monster format goes a long way for many people's campaign. I'm sure I am not the only one that feels this way and devoting just a couple of pages to statting a creature really is not asking much at all. No ones campaign is going to go down the tubes if Asmodeus' stats are given or the stats for the abyssal layer that's living or some uber-obyrith lord.And, yes, I am one of the few that enjoyed 3E Deities&Demigods because if Greek heroes can tackle deities why can't PCs if they ever wanted to aspire to be a "Greek-hero" type?And, no, epic monsters do not pop like a video game. You might as well state the same thing when dragons and beholders start becoming more prominent in a campaign once the PCs suddenly hit double-digits in level. It's just the way the game works.Of course, throwing the 1000th 15th-level kobold villain will grind your players nerves if that's how such games are run.I don't play, I DM full-time, but if I did play I am the spiteful type---if the DM makes something unkillable, I'll find a way to do it no matter how many characters are sacrificed trying. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f61b.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":p" title="Stick out tongue    :p"  data-smilie="7"data-shortname=":p" /></blockquote>

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