Strongholds?

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Tinker Gnome

Explorer

• Oct 20, 2007

• #1

I always hear how people's PCs build strongholds and build up their own armies. This experience is totally alien to me as in the games I play in we pretty much always zip across the contient or world all the time and do not have time for strongholds or followers. The idea of PCs paying taxes is alien to me too cause the PCs never stay in one place long enough.

Tax Collector: *Knocks on Inn door* Hello? I am here to collect the taxes for those fellows who came into town a couple of days ago?
Inn Keeper: Them? They left last night.
Tax Collector: Oh...

I am not saying that Stronghold building or taxes in the game are bad, I am just curious to other people's experiences with them.

 

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Dan Bell

First Post

• Oct 20, 2007

• #2

One of the best products for dealing with a semi-real method for feudal fiefs involves HarnManor: http://www.columbiagames.com/cgi-bin/query/cfg/zoom.cfg?product_id=4751
where PCs are the lords of their own village and must manage the fief.

See my Goffin Manor article if you want to see a free example of what HarnManor data looks like: http://www.lythia.com/modules.php?o...req=viewdownloaddetails&lid=244&ttitle=Goffin

 

MoogleEmpMog

First Post

• Oct 20, 2007

• #3

It's definitely been the exception rather than the norm in the games I've run and played in. Even in BECMI D&D and AD&D, we usually just glossed over the stronghold and follower rules at higher levels because they weren't what we were interested in.

I've had PCs become important political and cultural figures before (one pretty much inadvertently became the patron of his own heretical sect; another impersonated and may or may not have replaced a king ), but both of those were in the same campaign, and even then it didn't come up much IN PLAY after the sessions in which it happened.

 

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Ogrork the Mighty

Explorer

• Oct 20, 2007

• #4

Galeros said:

The idea of PCs paying taxes is alien to me too cause the PCs never stay in one place long enough.

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That's why taxes are normally imposed at the gates of the city.

 

T

Tinker Gnome

Explorer

• Oct 20, 2007

• #5

Ogrork the Mighty said:

That's why taxes are normally imposed at the gates of the city.

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Good point. But it would get to the point where the PCs would do everything in their power to get out of it, and I really do not care enough about taxes to really bother.

 

Treebore

First Post

• Oct 20, 2007

• #6

Its all determined by what players want. Like right now my younger son and daughter are really into these aspects of their characters, so I've been getting a lot of mileage out of my books covering these aspects. In over 22 years of gaming I think I have had maybe 5 other players who got into these aspects of their character. Which is good, because it makes them very powerful.

 

Gilladian

Adventurer

• Oct 20, 2007

• #7

I've been playing with two of the same players for 15 years, now (My husband and my best friend). My friend always plays a type of character who is interested in establishing a home, taking on hirelings and dependents, and building a family (though, interestingly, she never wants a romantic relationship). My husband wants a power-base. He always tries to win titles, buy land or become otherwise a local authority.

So I've always just worked those concepts into the plot. It helps that I prefer a slightly low-end magic game, with a usual end-game somewhere around 12th level.

I can't imagine them avoiding the tax collectors - they just find a way to suborn them, usually! In one game, they were given a mission to collect taxes from a group living on the fringe of a barony. Needless to say, hijinks and near-war were the result...

 

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Slapzilla

First Post

• Oct 21, 2007

• #8

Having a home base changes the play flow from run-n-gun, bash 'em up adventuring to getting along with your neighbors, diplomacy role playing stuff. I've always wanted a home base and a few years back ran one for my players.

The property came with tenant farmers, hunting rights and a title. 4 neighbors in the valley and a half-orc village a short ride away.

Of course the house was haunted, and had a demonologist lich in the basement. The forest on the border was infested with warring lycanthropes. One of the neighbors was a devil with MANY Wizard levels and a portal to the Plane of Shadow. The major city a day's ride away was preparing for the orc invasion foaming out of the north. Typical adventuring stuff.

I had beautiful backstory for everything. My players became bored with the lack of 'adventure'. I suspect that they just needed a controller in hand and not a DM at all. One day....

 

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Hejdun

First Post

• Oct 21, 2007

• #9

IMO, the 3.x system discourages strongholds, simply because it's near impossible to defend a stronghold against, well, anything. Walls are useless when there are so many ways to bypass (flying, burrowing, etherealness) or destroy them (disintegrate, move earth, stone to mud, etc.). Offense always trumps defense. Also, the system makes standard guards/soldiers (level 2-3 warriors) nearly useless against anything level/CR 5 or higher.

IMO, the best way to handle tax collection in a higher magic/powered campaign is to tax magic items at the city gates through a permanent Detect Magic effect. Place a tax on certain strength magic items and hand out some sort of counter that PCs can produce to prove that they've paid the tax for that year.

It also has lots of opportunity for chaotic characters to have minor run ins with the law through trying to circumvent tax collection.

 

HelloChristian

First Post

• Oct 21, 2007

• #10

Slapzilla said:

I had beautiful backstory for everything. My players became bored with the lack of 'adventure'. I suspect that they just needed a controller in hand and not a DM at all. One day....

Click to expand...

That sounded like an epic game. What couldn't you have done? Eh, too bad.