D&D 5E [META] Realistic Optimization

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faria

First Post

• Feb 2, 2016

• #1

Let's be real: I've never had a campaign that went to level 20. My current group has been together for over a year and we're still only level 12. Outside of this group, I never had a campaign that went past level 8.

I'm guessing most campaigns never make it to 10. So why are we planning to 20? Shouldn't we be realistic about our optimization and assume a lower level cap? What do you guys think?

What level would be realistic to plan around? Level 10 and 11 get some major milestones, so maybe somewhere around there? Maybe lower if we're being honest? Level 7 or 8?

 

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Kithas

First Post

• Feb 3, 2016

• #2

My first character that we started around when the phb came out is very near 20, others in the party are at 20. We also had a long hiatus of a few months and we don't always play that campaign. Generally I talk to my dm, personally I want to be levelling every 2 sessions to keep things interesting, that's 40 sessions to 20, still a good long while but faster than some dm's are expecting.

As to your other question(or the only question really) I like to plan for and help people plan for 3,5,11, and 20. Having an overall goal in mind is nice and motivates you to move forward and get stronger.

 

Blue

Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal

• Feb 5, 2016

• #3

I do see a lot of individual builds that don't come together until advanced levels, and that makes no sense to me unless you are starting at a high level, since you still need to pull your weight up to that point.

That said, most of the handbooks seem to cover what you can get out of every level of play, so can address the levels you are concerned with. For example, some rate spells and have commentary "this starts great but doesn't scale well" or others "this shouldn't be a first priority, but at higher levels when facing more monsters with resistance it's a useful spell for your low-level slots". So if you are playing not to much higher then the level you get those spells, the first is quite good for you and the second not so much. Just takes some reading beyond just looking at the summary color.

 

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FormerlyHemlock

Hero

• Feb 5, 2016

• #4

faria said:

Let's be real: I've never had a campaign that went to level 20. My current group has been together for over a year and we're still only level 12. Outside of this group, I never had a campaign that went past level 8.

I'm guessing most campaigns never make it to 10. So why are we planning to 20? Shouldn't we be realistic about our optimization and assume a lower level cap? What do you guys think?

Click to expand...

For me, a plan isn't fun unless both the journey and the destination are enjoyable. I don't like builds that don't come together until level 14-17, but neither do I like builds that are fun at levels 4-8 and then dead-end. That's why I would never multiclass a Moon Druid, because taking even one level of Rogue permanently "wrecks" the PC as far as my enjoyment is concerned.

 

ccs

41st lv DM

• Feb 5, 2016

• #5

I don't really plan out characters on a lv by lv mechanical basis prior to playing.

I'll consider the setting & what we know of the campaign at the start. I'll create a character that fits that. And I'll have some ideas of the characters longer term goals story-wise. Every now & then though there'll be something I HAVE to plan ahead for - like Prestige Classes pre-reqs in 3x/PF.
After that? Well, I choose mechanical options based what's actually going on in the game, what's going on with my character. Same applies to my RP goals. Sometimes that has resulted in the character evolving differently than I'd otherwise have expected.

 

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Coyote81

First Post

• Feb 6, 2016

• #6

Lately I've been planing my builds with a level 10 goal, meaning that I want it to be completed by level 10 and if we get beyond that I'm just adding gravy to an enjoyable build. Example: My Barbarian Shaman. Totem Barbarian 6 (Wolf and Eagle) Rune Scribe 5 (Yes I know that is 11 levels, but it's basically completely online by level 8-9)

This is an interesting build from start to end imo, and after finishing rune scribe (or perhaps earlier) I would switch to either a few more level in barbarian (level10) then perhaps 5 levels in rogue for uncanny dodge. (Having damage plus resistance while raging is awesome at high levels) Ending up with Totem Barb10 Rune Scribe 5 Arcane Trickster 5

 

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bid

First Post

• Feb 6, 2016

• #7

It's hard to get anything useful before level 4 and your first feat (or some cleric 1 / archetype 3 MC combo).

By level 8, you'll get your second feat (or reach extra attack 5 / archetype 3). At that point your character should be fully operational.

The real problem is finding something that works at level 5, where the delay in extra attack or fireball can be painful.


OTOH, that hour you waste optimizing to level 20 for every campaign is nothing compared to the 100 hours you'll play before one of your 10 campaigns goes past level 15.

But yeah, why waste 100 hours on lame duck characters that only shine past level 15?

 

Zardnaar

Legend

• Feb 7, 2016

• #8

My guides and advice are for playable characters from the get go. You might be slightly inferior at certain levels (fighter1/bladelock4 vs fighter 5) but it is usually only a 1 level hiccup.

 

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RenZhe

First Post

• Feb 8, 2016

• #9

I usually try to optimize to cap off around Lv 11-12 and pray I somehow get to play it up to 15. Lv 17-20 features are most certainly dead to me, and fighter is a class that only has 11 levels.

 

TheLoneRanger1979

First Post

• Feb 9, 2016

• #10

Some overall good points. When the last play test came around i was planning to lvl20 myself too. However, right now i shoot for lvl 10. It seams like a much more realistic goal. Especially because we started at lvl1 and we don't play that often (we just hit lvl5 in our main). My concept called for a fighter/ranger so i figured good 6 consecutive levels in fighter and then 4 in ranger would do. If my concept character lives that long, i will think about how to advance from then. Meanwhile i am experimenting with different ways of customizing a fighter.