D&D 5E Does WotC suck at selling games?

[Thank Dog]

One thing I definitely agree with the article is the concept of a real DM teaching manual.


I learned DMing when I was 20...and I remembered being terrified that I was going to screw it up! My friend (our groups DM) gave me a sample adventure to run, walked me through the basics, gave me advice. A few sessions...and the rest was history. But without that initial training, I might never have started.

I have to strongly disagree on this point. I constantly see in discussions and people asking about how to DM this notion of "doing it right". I think it's vitally important that players and DM's find their own way to do things rather than being told by others what is the right and the wrong way to do it. Throwing DM's and players in the deep end is, IMO, the most fun part of learning how to play and fosters a more creative and passionate player as they tend to be less tied to rules as laws and more inclined towards rules as guidelines.

Playing with the generation of players who began with 3.x or Pathfinder is, for me, exhausting. The encouragement in those systems to strictly adhere to RAW has been a major part of why I haven't enjoyed or participated in such games for the last decade. What I'm finding with new players in 5e is a willingness to let their imaginations fly and the result is a far more enjoyable game for everyone. I'd like to see that encouraged and a DM's guide is something that I think will only serve to discourage that type of play.

 

[Dire Bare]

AngryDM is right on, IMO. It's not that the hobby isn't growing . . . it is. It's not that the new edition is terrible or that the PHB & MM (and eventual DMG) are lackluster . . . because they aren't, they're fantastic! It's that the market for D&D, the hobby, grows steadily but slowly when it could be experiencing a major renaissance in awareness and player base (theoretically, at least).

What I would love to see from WotC:

1. Continue cross-marketing and building bridges with board games, video games, and movies/TV. I'm sure WotC already has this part handled.
2. The online video tutorials Mearls alluded to at some point are a good idea, but I would love to see an online, video-game like tutorial that teaches you how to play. And another that teaches you the basics of how to DM.
3. I'd also like to see at least a basic wiki-style encyclopedia of basic D&D terms, to answer noob questions like "What's an elf?" or "What's a glaive?" Of course, I'd also love to see a comprehensive D&D wiki (my gods, that would be a herculean project)!
4. I'd love to see a hardback "Beginner's Guide" that takes the Basic Rules and layers on the tutorials and the fluff to introduce noobies to both the game itself, the assumed terminology, and to the D&D fantasy cosmology also.
5. Finally, a redone Starter Set that assumes no familarity with D&D and even the overall fantasy genre at all. Lots of tutorials without overly hand-holding. The digital ebook version of the Starter Set should be $0.00 and be available in every format that makes sense (PDF, MOBI, EPUB, perhaps others).

AND I WANT IT NOW! NOW! Well, okay, maybe not NOW, but soon? Year-ish?

 

[GameDoc]

An interesting analogy - as this very week Hasbro is in a court case to clear up movie rights.

AngryDM seems to have missed the memo where they've said the goal is now about profits for the brand, not driving sales of the RPG directly.

Though, it occurs to me that a *good* D&D movie might bring people into the hobby better than any tutorial product could....

Hasbro's efforts at turning its other properties into movies leaves me doubtful we'll get anything better than we saw with the last effort at a feature D&D movie.

The G.I. Joe films were horrendous.

The Transformer films, while better, were still essentially special effects bonanzas with little real substance underneath. Admittedly, they seem to have sparked a renewed vigor in the toy line and a new wave of animated series. So a high profile D&D movie could generate some interest in the game itself. But Transformers also had the ability to play on the nostalgia of a wider segment of children of the 80s.

My fear is that a D&D movie is going to be more on the quality of G. I. Joe.

 

[Dire Bare]

One thing I definitely agree with the article is the concept of a real DM teaching manual.


I learned DMing when I was 20...and I remembered being terrified that I was going to screw it up! My friend (our groups DM) gave me a sample adventure to run, walked me through the basics, gave me advice. A few sessions...and the rest was history. But without that initial training, I might never have started.

Yes. A "DM's Manual" that teaches the ABC's of Dungeonmastering!

I have to strongly disagree on this point. I constantly see in discussions and people asking about how to DM this notion of "doing it right". I think it's vitally important that players and DM's find their own way to do things rather than being told by others what is the right and the wrong way to do it. Throwing DM's and players in the deep end is, IMO, the most fun part of learning how to play and fosters a more creative and passionate player as they tend to be less tied to rules as laws and more inclined towards rules as guidelines.

A good "DM's Manual" is not what you fear. It wouldn't teach the "one-true-way" to run games, but walk folks through the basics while encouraging them to free their creativity once they have their feet under them. You've got to learn the rules before you can intelligently break the rules. Right now most DM's just kind of throw themselves into it . . . and some survive to continue on running games well, others survive to continue running games poorly, and others run screaming from the table. While that satisfies the elitist in us surviving DM's, it doesn't do much to grow sales or the hobby.

 

[Dire Bare]

Hasbro's efforts at turning its other properties into movies leaves me doubtful we'll get anything better than we saw with the last effort at a feature D&D movie.

The G.I. Joe films were horrendous.

The Transformer films, while better, were still essentially special effects bonanzas with little real substance underneath. Admittedly, they seem to have sparked a renewed vigor in the toy line and a new wave of animated series. So a high profile D&D movie could generate some interest in the game itself. But Transformers also had the ability to play on the nostalgia of a wider segment of children of the 80s.

My fear is that a D&D movie is going to be more on the quality of G. I. Joe.

While I agree that the GI Joe and Transformers movies were, ah, not the highest quality of films . . . they were leagues better than the four (?) D&D movies we've gotten so far! We've got nowhere to go but up! Hmm, now I feel like I've somehow jinxed the next film release . . .

Creating greater awareness and interest in the game is important . . . but converting the D&D-curious into not just players, but DMs is going to require even more than a blockbuster and critical hit at the box office. Although, that would be nice. I dream of a Dragonlance Chronicles TV show in the vein of Game of Thrones (but with significantly less boobs and blood) . . .

 

[Shroomy]

My fear is that a D&D movie is going to be more on the quality of G. I. Joe.

That would be a step up!

 

[GameDoc]

One could also argue that a fantasy adventure slapped with the D&D logo and scripted with D&D lingo isn't enough to get people gaming because it portrays the characters but not the players. When you just see the characters you may not be having any different an experience than watching Lord of the Rings, Game of Thrones, or Conan the Barbarian. It's just another fantasy setting.

I wonder if an adventure comedy along the lines of the Princess Bride would be better with framing and cut scenes portraying the DM and players. Don't just make fantasy adventures look entertaining, make fantasy gaming look entertaining.

its been done, I know, but always as a parody of the hobby, mostly targeted at existing gamers willing to laugh at themselves. But what if they chose not to focus on the geekiness of the players and instead on the friendship, fun, and natural humor that pervades real gaming?

Imagine getting a group of young actors of the quality they did for Harry Potter to be the players and casting them alongside the type of adult actors we get for superheroes nowadays. Or better yet show a gaming group of a wide age-range.

 

[Thank Dog]

A good "DM's Manual" is not what you fear. It wouldn't teach the "one-true-way" to run games, but walk folks through the basics while encouraging them to free their creativity once they have their feet under them. You've got to learn the rules before you can intelligently break the rules. Right now most DM's just kind of throw themselves into it . . . and some survive to continue on running games well, others survive to continue running games poorly, and others run screaming from the table. While that satisfies the elitist in us surviving DM's, it doesn't do much to grow sales or the hobby.

But it doesn't really matter what the manual says, the mere fact of its existence tells players and DM's that there is a right and a wrong way to do it.

If I had my way, the only DM's manual that would be required would consist of the following sentence:

"If you and your players are having fun, then you're playing the game "right"."

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

1. I don't think there was a lack of knowledge of orcs in the 1980s. Further, I'd add that if someone (in any time) is so out of tune with the tropes, then the idea that they would be inclined to become a majorly involved player is unlikely.

...

Awareness has no causal relationship on interest.

As I said, awareness is a precondition if interest. And it's not like you and I came out of the womb caring about d&d. Something struck our interest and we pursued it from there. Right now, there happen to be a lot more people exposed to those tropes than there were 20 years ago, which means more people who might play d&d and enjoy it.

 

[Allensh]

You know how I learned to be a gamemaster back in 1982? By becoming one. I decided that I wanted to run and so I did. I made some mistakes, listened to player feedback and triedto get better. 32 years later I am still running games.

In order to be a DM you first have to want to be a DM and no introductory product can make someone a DM if they don't want to be.

Allen