3 weeks till new Who!

[JustinAlexander]

I feel that your issue is with humour and whimsy. Madame Vastra? Whimsy. She's not a weak point because she doesn't do what *you* want her to do; she's a slightly whimsical nod to Holmes, with a double whimsical "she's a reptile" angle. That's it.

I've got no problem with Madame Vastra as a character. My problem is exclusively with the incredibly poor writing of that character. Please refrain from putting words in my mouth. It's incredibly rude.

Would a story centered on Vastra as the Great Detective be interesting? I think so. But's that not The Snowmen.

I'm not really convinced by your argument that bad writing is OK as long as it's not the main character being badly written.

 

[Mallus]

I'm not really convinced by your argument that bad writing is OK as long as it's not the main character being badly written.

I'm not convinced by your counterargument here because, well, you haven't made one.

I consider Madame Vastra to be a well-written character in The Snowmen because she performs her role in the story with aplomb. It's important to consider the character's function. If you don't do that, then you can't make a meaningful critique of the way she's written.

In order to show her being the "Great Detective" you'd need to make her the protagonist (which she isn't), or include scenes establishing her as a great detective (which there isn't space for in a hour-long teleplay in which she isn't the protagonist, and which has other things on its mind).

Put another way, telling isn't universally a sign of bad writing. You have to look at it in context.

Besides, like I said earlier, Moffat gives her one of the best lines in contemporary science fiction. That should count for something!

 

[Morrus]

Please refrain from putting words in my mouth. It's incredibly rude.

I've done no such thing. Let's drop the attitude please, eh?

 

[sabrinathecat]

One good line per hour does not equal good writing.
I could spout utter gibberish for 5 months straight (which some people seem to think I do), and one brilliant thought. That does not make up for the rest of the 5 months.

 

[Umbran]

Um, folks...

Consider this for a second.

Morrus: Hey, cool! This thing I really like is coming up soon!
You people: Yeah, well, that thing you really like is kinda crappy!

Folks are, of course, allowed their opinions, and are allowed to state them. But, really, could you be just a tad less relentless in spitting on things other people like? I mean, if you hate it that much, why are you bothering to talk about it? Isn't there something more constructive you could do with your time?

 

[Aeolius]

Isn't there something more constructive you could do with your time?

Time? Time? Was that a set-up?

Doctor Who Goodies at Think Geek

 

[sabrinathecat]

Imagine you like something a lot.
Then imagine that there is some change that you really don't like.
Then imagine that there is a forum in which you can express yourself. Chances are this expression won't make a change to restore/undo what has upset/disappointed you, but at least you can vent.
Oh, there is a chance you might find other people who are also upset by said change/alterations or disappointed by the continuation.
This offers the chance to build a community, even if it is one based on a negativity.
Thus, construction from frustration.

 

[Umbran]

Then imagine that there is a forum in which you can express yourself. Chances are this expression won't make a change to restore/undo what has upset/disappointed you, but at least you can vent.

Imagine you could create your own thread in that forum, in which you could vent without raining on other people's parades directly! What a coup that would be!

This offers the chance to build a community, even if it is one based on a negativity.

Not a fan of communities based on negativity. At all. That way lies nastiness. No thanks.

Oh, and I recognize the difference between constructive criticism and negativity - they aren't at all the same thing.

 

[Morrus]

Imagine you like something a lot.
Then imagine that there is some change that you really don't like.
Then imagine that there is a forum in which you can express yourself. Chances are this expression won't make a change to restore/undo what has upset/disappointed you, but at least you can vent.
Oh, there is a chance you might find other people who are also upset by said change/alterations or disappointed by the continuation.
This offers the chance to build a community, even if it is one based on a negativity.
Thus, construction from frustration.

Sabrina, if you want to start a thread about how much you dislike current Who, or Star Trek, or pies, or whatever - please feel free too. Nobody's saying you have to like these things or that you shouldn't say so. They're just saying that relentless threadcrapping in multiple threads of people just trying to enjoy something makes for an unpleasant environment.

So, please, start a thread - or threads - on that subject. I may well participate; others may, too, including some who agree with you. And that lets some of us have our thread about the new shiny, too.

 

[RangerWickett]

Man, I've only been watching Who for a couple years. I can't wait 'til I'm old enough to bish about how the new stuff sucks compared to Stephen Moffat and Matt Smith.