A pseudo-scientific explanation of magic

[Warrior Poet]

And voila! I've concocted a pseudo-scientific explanation for how magic (at least of some kind) could exist in a setting that is otherwise leaning much more towards sci-fi than traditional fantasy.

Any comments or helpful suggestions?

Yeah: That's the coolest explanation of magic in a scientific world I've ever heard.

It calls to mind the old Arthur C. Clark chestnut, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."

Though, your's definitely gives an edge to magic as a viable thing rather than simply an "unrecognized technology."

I'm sorry I don't have any helpful suggestions at present. I haven't been able (don't have the time at present) to parse out the complexity of what you're suggesting, and my knowledge of cosmology is pretty (very) limited.

But you're idea rocks!

Warrior Poet

 

[Warrior Poet]

Ooh! OK, I just thought of something: are you thinking that magic like this has consequences? From what you're describing (and I think this works really well in the Cthulhu magic context), it seems like it would be cool (and give you lots of future plot potential!) that any kind of manipulation of the universe at that level would have consequences. Not just "fireball" or "Red Sign of Shudde M'ell" but like quantum level consequences:

Changes in time flow. Altered perception. Adjustments to gravitation. The arrival of blasphemous gods heralded by mindless flutes piping from beyond space. That sort of thing.

Warrior Poet

 

[Desdichado]

Absolutely it would! Not only is it insanely difficult and complex, but the consequences of losing control for even a moment are potentially very catastrophic -- everything from the spell fizzling before doing anything at all to dark energy running amok doing all kinds of really nasty things. After all, one of the theoretical properties of dark energy is already that it counteracts gravity. In sufficiently concentrated forms, it could unravel, or counteract the strong and weak nuclear force, for example, resulting in a nice little thermonuclear explosion.

Other more exotic consequences are certainly out there too. Harnessing extra-universal energy, either from the bulk or from another brane that may or may not even share some of our own basic physical properties can't be good for you. What if it causes strange mutations, or radiation sickness, or all kinds of other nasty things?

And of course, there's the old vaguely Lovecraftian chestnut of alien sentiences from other branes, or even formless ones that drift through the bulk itself, and are drawn by the piercing that they percieve from that brane over there?

 

[Yair]

My personal favorite is the Many Worlds, One Mind interpertation of Quantum Mechanics. Basically, it means that the world constantly "multiplies" into different options according to the possible observations ("did the arrow go right or left?"), but that Mind, consciousness, perceives only one path. The trick to magic, then, is to be able to control which path our mind - and reality - takess. This leads to a psionics-flavored magic, which easily affects delicate and random phenomenon (including modern computers, and even more so quantum computers).
I think it is best depicted in Dune. For example, the jumping technology is random there, just enlarging and going through a random wormhole essentially, but the Navigator surveys the possible results and chooses the one fitting the ship's destination.

As for your higher-dimensions suggestion, I am afraid I have no more ideas, except that you may want to take it theologically. Different branes may be more perfect (Celestial) with higher dimensions, and are all after all mere projections of the one, M-theory, truth. In contrast low-dimensional universes will be more corrupt, and low-dimensional beings infernal. (This puts us, with 4 dimesnions out of 11, fairly low.) Hell, the most defile part of the multiverse, is a 1-dimensional sheer existence (no space) of insufferable pain.

 

[Gruns]

Hmmm...

What about midichlorians?

Gruns

 

[William Ronald]

Possibly material components serve as a focu8 for spellcasters, and are generally consumed during the spell casting process.

As for healing, perhaps the fact that much healing (in D&D games, at least) involve deities, perhaps entities from other "branes" could be guiding the character's spellcasting for their own purposes. (Some of these entities could be altruistic in nature. Or they may have other interests and agendas.) Alternately, if you can manipulate energy, you may be able to accelerate the natural healing process. (Possibly the transfer of energy allows healing of wounds which would otherwise be fatal.)

Based on what I have read, a cosmological model other than the "Great Wheel" could work well for this. (If you want the Great Wheel, it could just be the "branes" that people are most familiar with -- but which would not preclude the existence of other dimensions.)

 

[Andor]

What about midichlorians?

Gruns

Damm, beat me to it. Well it makes more sense than midiclorians in any event.

This is a very good premise to explain magic that does stuff with physical forces, but I don't see it working for, eg, mind effects; nor does it explain stuff like why you can magically create a whole bunch of lead but just a bit of gold. I think you're going to need a lot of ad-hoc explanations for individual spells if you want to create a coherent system.

I dunno. I could easily see a 'brane where memetic objects become physically manipulable, like David Brins E-level hyperspace.

Also for a good look at a world where Science and Magic coincide have a look a A Game of Universe by Eric Nylund. Star ships with magic circles for shields, Heros, Devils, Really Scary Nuns, Mages, Psions, Angels who cheat and Accidental Assasins.

Accessing alternate planes and taking advantage of different rulesets is a classic of science fiction, and fantasy as well, using it to do both at once should be no problem. Kinda like the 'Alternate Rules' disiples from the Dorsai books.

It occurs to me that the different 'schools' of magic could make sense as different 'branes that can be accessed for magic. IE: All divination spells mainipulate brane N+4.

Conversely the divine/arcane/psionic split makes less sense, although you could have both psis and mages with both sides insisting the source of power is the same but the other camp only has limited access to it due to their mental blinkers and only we do it right. Still not sure how to work in gods, unless you posit them as somekind of other braned entity that can be contacted by simple magic. Which can get pretty creepy if you look at it too closely...

 

[Storminator]

This is a very good premise to explain magic that does stuff with physical forces, but I don't see it working for, eg, mind effects; nor does it explain stuff like why you can magically create a whole bunch of lead but just a bit of gold. I think you're going to need a lot of ad-hoc explanations for individual spells if you want to create a coherent system.

Of course it's just as easy to make gold! Those fools just don't understand the forces they're dealing with! They laughed at my theories, but I'll show them. I'll show them all!

Behold! The Grand Unification Theory of Magic! My power will be unlimited!

Sounds like good mad scientist adventure to me...

PS

 

[Umbran]

but that Mind, consciousness, perceives only one path. The trick to magic, then, is to be able to control which path our mind - and reality - takess.

Our mind, singular? That presents a problem of more than just grammar. I don't think anyone wants to try to sell the idea that for all the sentients int eh world, there's only one mind that needs to be affected.

Then, you've got either magic that doesn't really have objective reality, because there are people you see now for whom that magic simply won't happen while it does happen for you, or you have to affect all the myriad minds in the universe at once, which just sounds implausible.

 

[Wayside]

On a similar note, it seems like you could explain a great deal of "magic" in a D&D like world through the unconscious manipulation of Zero Point Energy.

You might want to consider tying "Superstring" theory and "cosmic resonance" ideas in with real world occult ideas

I've been using both of these and a few others since I first read The Elegant Universe in 1999. Like Joshua I've also found Kaku an accessible writer for non-specialists, especially some of the discussion of what a being who could move as easily through all dimensions as we can through our 3 would be like (in Hyperspace I think it was). I haven't tried to reconcile this to normal D&D magic though; it seems to me much more powerful as something unique and useable in itself than as a mere explanation for some other spell system.

Or maybe all mages in this setting are autists.

If supercomputer ability is something you need, you could set them up somewhat like Dune's Mentats, with or without a substance dependence (although I think "with" is potentially much more interesting, depending on how the mechanics are handled. You'd get issues of addiction, wear and tear, characters building up a resistance and needing higher doses and so on, plus the commerce surrounding this substance is an instant source of plot hooks).

Absolutely it would! Not only is it insanely difficult and complex, but the consequences of losing control for even a moment are potentially very catastrophic -- everything from the spell fizzling before doing anything at all to dark energy running amok doing all kinds of really nasty things.

Going back to the idea of cosmic resonance, one of the ways I handle the unintended consequences is through echo. If manipulation of sound (or say any vibration; what if you could use your voice to heat things up or maipulate lightwaves? Fireballs and illusions--suddenly throwing your voice is much for fun) is necessary for various magical effects, it makes sense that things can get out of hand rather quickly with sounds running into other sounds, bouncing off objects, returning back to you etc. And of course, the more difficult the effect, the more easily things go to hell.