Abjurer, a ranged defender

[Quickleaf]

Because you inspired me I went and whipped up a version of my own. It's probably grossly overpowered since I put absolutely zero effort into considering balance issues and just blurted out all my thoughts onto a page. But hey, it comes from the heart

http://users.on.net/~kzach/abjurer.pdf

And that's what counts!

I really like what you came up with, particularly the clever use of a quasi mirror image. Is part of your idea that the enemies have to waste actions determining which of the illusions/projections is the real one?

More comments once I've properly digested it all

 

[Kzach]

And that's what counts!

I really like what you came up with, particularly the clever use of a quasi mirror image. Is part of your idea that the enemies have to waste actions determining which of the illusions/projections is the real one?

More comments once I've properly digested it all

Well, no, they're summoned creatures and obey (most of) the rules for such, occupying a space, flanking, using your actions, functioning as your allies (therefore gaining the benefit of the -2 mark penalty), but they also use your defences and have only as many hit points as your bloodied value. If they're destroyed, then you lose a healing surge. So it's a bit of a balancing act. They don't provide extra actions, but they do provide a buffer between you and the enemy, provide flanking for your allies, provide an extra pool of hit points and through them you can make your defender attacks, ie. the interrupts, opportunity attacks and reactions.

Because they're using your actions, though, even if you had ten of them flanking one creature, you could only use one of them for an opportunity attack. Of course you also only have one immediate action per round, so again even if you had multiple summoned creatures, you don't get any extra actions out of them. But if you had ten of them each adjacent to a separate creature, you could opportunity attack each one (if one is provoked).

So there's a balancing act there. You don't want to risk too many summons since there's minimal benefit to doing so, and if they're destroyed you just have to summon another one (action) and lose a healing surge and risk losing another healing surge.

 

[marelion]

This second variant is capable of performing some really nice tricks. The 10 healing surges as a base are a definite must, since Con is onl the tertiary stat for Abjurers, meaning they will likely start with something like 10 Surges after apllying Con in Quickleaf`s variant and that`s simply too few for a proper defender. So if I may suggest, grant your abjurer another healing surge, Quickleaf, I highly doubt it is going to have any negative impact on game-balance. A defender that`s sucked out of healing surges after two or three encounters would slow trhe game down too much.

Taking a quick glance at K`Zach`s build three things came to my attention: Continuance is a potential gamebreaker in Solo/Elite encounters. Forbiding saving throws is a big "NO, NO" in 4E. Abilities like this truly have the potential of shutting a solo down. There are too many ways to abuse this power to create the dreaded 'Solo-stunlock' Combine the Abjurer with an Orbizard and watch your parties wreck your solos in no time.

Dispellation is another very strong power, but I would have to see it in action at my gaming table to determine whether to nerf it or not.

I`m not sure about Avoidance, -4 to attack sounds too harsh but then again it only affects the next attack roll against a chosen target. If I were you, I`d probably change the power a bit to sth. like this:

Avoidance

Standard Action Implement

Intelligence vs Fortitude

Hit: The target takes a -2 penalty to all attack rolls against an ally of your choice until the start of your next turn.The first time the target attacks the chosen ally before the start of your next turn, you can make a ranged basic attack against the triggering enemy as a free action with a bonus to the damage roll equal to your charisma-modifier.


This way you still get some effect against multi-attacking monsters and the monster truly has a motivation to leave your ally in peace. Attacks like Avoidance IME only get used when the need is dire( a bloodied leader the monster could finish off with a single attack or sth. like this) and in a situation like the one i just created most monsters would stick to their target despite a mere penalty to attack rolls.

I`ll give you a more elaborate feedback once I`ve had the time to check these two builds more thoroughly.

 

[the Jester]

Your sample dude seems to have a lot of powers for only 6th level.

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

I love the idea of an abjurer in 4e, and both examples provided have cool things going on. I'd love to see something "official" based on these ideas... anyone feel up to a submission to WotC?

 

[Quickleaf]

Your sample dude seems to have a lot of powers for only 6th level.

Nah, not really. 2 at-wills plus class features, 2 encounters, 2 dailies, 2 utilities, 1 race, and 1 magic item. About par for the course.

I love the idea of an abjurer in 4e, and both examples provided have cool things going on. I'd love to see something "official" based on these ideas... anyone feel up to a submission to WotC?

Thanks! Kzach's class I think feels a little more like an abjurer, but they both are fairly unique and not something any classes do yet. Submission? I have a hard enough go of organizing and making time for my submissions to the e-magazines!

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

I liked the defender mechanic that you gave your Abjurer, and I also liked the fact that it built upon some Swordmage stuff. WotC has been doing that lately with classes tapping into Wizard powers, but I don't think that's all bad. It keeps the ridiculous option bloat down somewhat.

Though I liked some of Kzach's power choices. I agree that they perhaps felt more thematic.

 

[Unwise]

I do like the idea and it is something I have been tinkering with myself too. My version of the ranged arcane defender is a summoner. He slowly fills the battlefield with minions who can make opportunity attacks and protect his friends.

I like the concept and I like the powers, assuming you are looking for feedback there are a few things I would consider:

- Concept is the most important thing, balance is just maths that can be adjusted. I think that this guys concept is sound.

- Sheilding swordmages have a pretty strong defensive ability. At low level this guy seems to be able to do that at least as well, while at the same time having a great punishment. The swordmage forgoes decent punishment by giving their friends good defence, they don't get both.

- The ward would need to scale in some way of course, I know this is a low level sample.

- I'm not sure that the bolt attack should have both a push and be a basic attack and be used with counterstrike. Pushing opportunity attacks are very powerful on a knight. Then it requires proper positioning to negate the enemies attack. In this guys case he can really invalidate most attacks on a friend within 10 squares if he hits.

Doh, have to run, will check back later.

 

[Quickleaf]

[MENTION=98008]Unwise[/MENTION] Thanks for the comments!

Swordmage warding is strong, but here's some of my thinking:

The abjurer doesn't have marking or teleporting like the assault swordmage NOR damage reduction like the shielding swordmage; these things are reactions whereas the abjurer must sustain wards to benefit from ranged opportunity attacks.

The abjurer prefers to be at range, and since ranged attacks target NADS slightly more than melee attacks, a bonus to AC is less valuable to an abjurer than a swordmage.

You raise a good point about the arcane bolt, but I'm not convinced it's overpowered. It only works as an opportunity attack when a PC protected by the abjurer's ward is attacked. Since the abjurer will likely only have 2 wards at once, and since the opportunity attack doesn't trigger on movement, it seems like a balanced feature.

 

[Unwise]

It just seems to me that the Abjurer is getting some of the sheilding of the Sheilding Swordmage, or very close to, and the damage of the assault swordmage, plus a knockback that completely stops the damage.

In practice, won't it play a lot like a swordmage using a paragon feat to mark two targets within range? The effect is the same, protecting the ally that is fighting that creature by shielding them for X amount of damage, thus making them less viable targets. They miss out on the -2 to hit, but on the plus side, if they are getting pounded by 3 enemies, it does work against all of them.

The assault swordmage can deal a basic attack against the one person they have marked within 10 squares. I would think that the advantages of teleporting are negated by the disadvantages of having to teleport. In many cases the swordmage would wish to stay where they have positioned themselves, as opposed to moving to an enemy dictated part of the battlefield.

I like both of the ideas (minus the pushback on an interrupting ranged basic attack) I am sure it can be tinkered with, the concept is sound. I just suspect it should maybe work like different builds. A sheilding Abjurer has a more powerful version of the bubble of protection, the punishing Abjurer's punishes those that defy the ward in more damaging ways.

I don't believe the balance is broken, just pushing the limits in a way I would prefer them not to be pushed.

Also, you will need some rules about how these wards interract with other defenders. I would really not want an Abjurer putting a 5DR ward with punishing attack on the knight who has just locked down the front line.

As an afterthought, what about making the bolt attack give -2 to hit? There are many such attacks you could copy to keep it consistent. It also mimics the -2 to hit from a mark. Maybe make it an effect, so it does not require a hit to activate the -2. I think I would be far more comfortable with this than a pushback.

P.S. I was just thinking, if you had a guy surrounded by 5 normal melee opponents anywhere within 10 squares of an abjurer, if they all attack the warded guy none of them can hit unless the Abjurer misses with his attack. He will have dealt great damage to them and even if they are missed and manage to hit themselves, they hit for 5 less damage. I don't really think that works for me, I would consider making the punishing bolt attack an immediate interrupt rather than an OA so it can only be used once per round. It might be a different story if it did not push though.