Adventures with extensive backstory

[Imaculata]

I don't mind all the backstory so much when it is my homebrew setting though, and I made things easier on myself by creating a timeline of historical events.

What truly makes a difference though, is that with my homebrew campaign, all of the history matters, and is woven into the adventures of the players. It isn't just fluff, which tends to be the case with a lot of modules. A lot of modules tends to have backstory that is pretty much irellevant to the main plot of the adventure, and/or is cliche and badly written. That I cannot stand.

More lore =! better lore

 

[pickin_grinnin]

That's one reason that I have always written my own adventures. If I make things up, I can remember them easier. If I were to use a published adventure, though, chances are that I would strip out the backstory and replace it with my own version, using people and place names that I can remember.

When it comes to backstory, I just make a bullet list of key concepts, events, and names, then improv everything else. I never read things out loud to players.

To be honest, though, backstory can generally be greatly simplified for one-shot games. The players usually don't care that much when it comes to one-shots.

 

[S'mon]

And for the most part, I like the Paizo APs. Even if I don’t plan on running specific ones or exposing all of an NPC’s biography, I still have fun reading them. And that’s partly why they do include some copious detail - because there are people like me reading them.

Yes, this is the reason (along with paid-by-the-word, and a monthly page count to fill) why random monster #57 gets a three-column backstory in the Paizo AP. I find it frequently makes the APs very hard to actually use in regular tabletop play, so I'm against it even if well written, which it often isn't - there are like a million identikit hot-but-tragic-babe NPC villains who 'attack immediately' and 'fight to the death'. The first one in PF#1 A History of Ashes (edit: Nualia) was cool, but for me it gets really boring after a while, even just reading it.

 

[Lanefan]

It depends on if I’m enjoying the writing. If it’s good, 4 pages is nothing. If it’s bad, a paragraph is a chore.

And for the most part, I like the Paizo APs. Even if I don’t plan on running specific ones or exposing all of an NPC’s biography, I still have fun reading them. And that’s partly why they do include some copious detail - because there are people like me reading them.

This tells me Paizo are missing the boat on some money, perhaps...?

Instead of trying to shove both a story and some adventures into an AP, they should instead release a) the bare-bones adventures with ju-ust enough bullet-point story to tie them together, for those who want to DM it; and concurrently b) a novelization of the AP for those who want to read it. The problem then would be keeping the novel(s) out of the players' hands until the DM had a chance to run the AP.

Lan-"in a desert-based AP would they have to include bulette-point story?"-efan

 

[Dioltach]

Like I am a guest in that world instead of the actual true DM. Hard to describe...

That's exactly how I feel. It's the same with published settings where the actions of NPCs are described at length (FR in particular).

 

[Imaculata]

IIt also makes it feel... alien to me. Like... I have to be true to the cannon or something. Like I am a guest in that world instead of the actual true DM. Hard to describe...

I feel the same way. I find it hard to make the world my own. It feels like I'm playing someone elses world, and I get annoyed easily by badly named characters and locations. It is also hard to play the role of an npc when his backstory seems cookiecutter/dime a dozen. It makes it feel like I'm holding up a cardboard cutout of an npc and making sounds that some what resemble speech.

Heck, I didn't even make it past one of the first blocks of text in Lost Mines of Phandelver before my eyes started to roll over. Phandalin, Cragmaw tribe, Gundren Rockseeker and his escort named Sildar Hallwinter, villains called Glasstaff and The Black Spider, Old Owl Well, the town of Thundertree, Wave Echo Cave... Those names, every single one of them, is TERRIBLE. I'm sure the adventure itself is fine (I've heard positive things about it), but I cannot get past the bad names.

If I as a DM do not believe these people and places can exist, then I cannot convince my players that they do. I know this is a fantasy game, and the adventure will obviously have fictional characters in them, but those are not real names. They sound fake and uninspired. The first thing I would do is change the names, but at that point I might as well write my own adventure.

I don't think my players would make it past the first chapter of Lost Mines of Phandelver without constantly forgetting the name Gundren. What kind of name is that? That doesn't sound like a real person. I have a dwarf in my homebrew campaign called Ulvar. At least that sounds like an actual name that they can pronounce and remember. Or Beler the Blessed. Perfectly fine (And it works because it is an alliteration).

And what kind of name is Glasstaff? That doesn't inspire any mystery or fear. I have villains in my campaign called Sharokina, Karagoz, Lady Yori, Aram Seen the Unseen, Sahastra. A villain-name has to sound kind of cool, right? It may very well be that Glasstaff is a really interesting character, who plays a very cool part in the overal story, but I cannot get beyond that name. I can't run a module with poor names.

 

[Morrus]

And what kind of name is Glasstaff? That doesn't inspire any mystery or fear. I have villains in my campaign called Sharokina, Karagoz, Lady Mori, Aram Seen the Unseen, Sahastra. A villain-name has to sound kind of cool, right? It may very well be that Glasstaff is a really interesting character, who plays a very cool part in the overal story, but I cannot get beyond that name. I can't run a module with poor names.

I personally prefer names like Glasstaff and The Black Spider over Sharokina and Sahastra, as there's no way on earth I'm going to remember the latter. And I don't think Glasstaff is any worse than Skywalker.

 

[S'mon]

I personally prefer names like Glasstaff and The Black Spider over Sharokina and Sahastra, as there's no way on earth I'm going to remember the latter. And I don't think Glasstaff is any worse than Skywalker.

I'm fine with Glasstaff, but Phandelver just didn't work for me or my group and I think the names were a factor. Conversely I'm loving the Gygaxian names in Village of Hommlet - Ostler Gundigroot, Furnok of Ferd, Lareth the Beautiful, Rufus & Burne.

 

[Imaculata]

I personally prefer names like Glasstaff and The Black Spider over Sharokina and Sahastra, as there's no way on earth I'm going to remember the latter. And I don't think Glasstaff is any worse than Skywalker.

Skywalker is a terrible name as well, only it is meant to be campy. The bad name is intentional with Star Wars.

But try saying the name "Glasstaff" to yourself, and now say the name "Sharokina". Which of the two sounds more menacing? Opinions can of course differ on what makes a good name (and thats fine), but for me, it is definitely the latter that sounds better.

Then there's a name like Aram Seen the Unseen, which I only had to mention once and my players never forgot it. It has a lyrical quality to it that just makes it work.

I'm fine with Glasstaff, but Phandelver just didn't work for me or my group and I think the names were a factor. Conversely I'm loving the Gygaxian names in Village of Hommlet - Ostler Gundigroot, Furnok of Ferd, Lareth the Beautiful, Rufus & Burne.

Phandelver iself is indeed also a terrible name, while a name like Gundigroot kind of rolls off the tongue, and it is funny to say. Furnok of Ferd is an alliteration, and there for by definition easier to remember and say. Good names are really important if I want to enjoy running an adventure. I want my players to be able to remember the names of npc's, and not be calling one of the main npc's "that dwarf guy, what's his face".

 

[billd91]

Phandelver iself is indeed also a terrible name, while a name like Gundigroot kind of rolls off the tongue, and it is funny to say. Furnok of Ferd is an alliteration, and there for by definition easier to remember and say. Good names are really important if I want to enjoy running an adventure. I want my players to be able to remember the names of npc's, and not be calling one of the main npc's "that dwarf guy, what's his face".

Good names is often in the eye (ear) of the beholder. Many Gygaxian names are memorable because they sound ridiculous. Many don't roll off the tongue at all - if you can even manage to give them a reasonable pronunciation.