Pathfinder 1E Advice for way of the wicked?

[Fooly_Cooly]

Well I got the second book but I will be taking a break from dming. I need to be a PC. I havent been a player in a game in a almost a year now and have finished the first book and done many many sessions of a homebrew campaign. I kinda need the joys of urking a fellow dm every once in a while. Hah. So I hope this thread helped everyone find advice for your path to darkness! I want to thank gdmcbride for all his helpful advice to us players and for clearing up questions about the books. Good luck out there fellow villians!

 

[ShadowDenizen]

WARNING SOME SPOILERS Lol. The cook thing is awesome. Grumblejack in ours got the same treatment. Sent to fight the guards and the pc's just watched until he was dead and jumped in the fray.

Yes, our group caught on to the fireplace trick, so they sent Grumblejack (whom they affectionally call “Apple Jacks”) to fight the guards on the stairs, and they headed down into the kitchen, where they promptly killed the two cooks (with a pot of boiling oil.)

For those who know the Muppets, I kinda envisioned Grumblejack as an ADD version of Sweetums. (“Hey guys! Wait for me!”) . After some healing, Grumblejack and our Dwarven Cleric PC actually have formed quite an unexpected bond which was unexpected and gratifying, and pretty amusing, to boot. Grumblejack has now “adopted” the cleric.

That said, my group (unexpectedly) turn out to be much more the “Let’s Fight Our Way Out” as opposed to “Let’s Sneak Through This Place”, so I had to adjust the module accordingly. (They missed the chance to explore the tower and confront the Warden [THAT will come back to haunt them], though they DID get to kick the crap out of Blackerly, which they really seemed to enjoy.)

Given that they took QUITE a beating in the prison, I hand-waved the travel across the moors, and let them outrun Lashtongue to make it to the manor in short order.

There was actually A LOT of exposition from Cardinal Thorn; it doesn’t seem as much when reading it on paper, but when outlining his “Master Plan”, I quickly decided to paraphrase the major points. (They were not enamored of him, to say the least; the players [as opposed to the characters] seemed to unfortunately think he was a bit of a cliché.)

The one interesting event that I ran with was our Anti-Paladin (who has a high charisma and fancies himself a “Ladies Man”) has established a realtionship with Tiadora. As written, she’s pretty ambivalent [if not downright belligerent] to the party, but I wanted to reward the player for his effort, so I’ll run with that subplot for now and see how it plays out.

The party also enjoted the opportunity to get some NPC interaction in with the other group in the manor. They’re still feeling each other out, so the interations have been mostly neutral. (Again, to stir the pot, I’ve had one of the members of the other Knot ALSO try to strike a relationship with Tiadora.)

 

[Aberzanzorax]

Spoilers, spoilers everywhere!

My players are just one lone session in.

They have no thief and had a good plan to get out (using mage hand, sleep, command, etc) with several contingencies as well.

Well, I, as DM roll in front of em. That lone guard just COULDN'T fail a save. Eventually, they were able to get out (with the oracle down to one single spell, which he used to heal Grumblejack). Shortly after that, a guard was able to play his signal horn and it all went to hell (in a bad way).

The guards withdrew into a group at the base of the stairs, and the pcs assaulted them, with Grumblejack (grateful for the healing) leading the charge. Once again, with four guards attacking, I got three hits, one of which was a (gratefully uncomfirmed) crit. Grumblejack went down. The pcs didn't even sacrifice him....he just has a 40 foot movement rate (unarmored) and got there first.

The pcs then gambled on using the "window" on the wall, and jumped through it to the west side of the keep...just as the warden had made his way outside his tower (right in front of them). With Grumblejack down, and the warden coming at them from the west, the guards (commanded by a drunk Blackerly) advanced from the east, through the same hole as the pcs.

The guards were slowed by the four squares of "difficult terrain" from the fallen Grumblejack, Blackerly stumbling along behind them. Several successful saves from the warden later, and things were looking dire. Until...


Two things turned the tide. 1. The pcs drained the warden's strength and the Inquisitor grappled the warden and dragged him into the entranceway of his tower. Now they have a hostage. 2. Tiadora, watching over the pcs (scuttling on the ceiling invisibly) and grumblejack (perhaps sensing his fiendish potential), decided to add a bit of fun. While commanded not to help the pcs, she had no orders against helping Grumblejack (who is technically not to become part of the 9th knot). She silently dribbled a healing potion into his mouth, and he popped up with a roar: "Your God's away on Business!"

(Grumblejack, in my campaign, is a mix between Animal from the muppets and Tom Waits, with a bit of Charles Bukowski thrown in out of combat). Here's his theme song:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9mhsW5aWJM"]Tom Waits - "God's Away On Business" - YouTube[/ame]




Blackerly, separated from his guards by an angry and vengeful Grumblejack, started shrieking for them to "Attack the ogre! SAVE ME!" And ran the only direction he could...away from the PCs and the warden's tower.


And that's where we left off.

 

[Aberzanzorax]

Oh, and regarding Cardinal Thorn...any thoughts on fleshing out his character?

I'm thinking that having him somewhat "representative of the genre", or as your players said, cliche, might be good in a way. Straying too much from the standard might focus more on him and less on the interesting pcs.


Some slight changes I'm making to him (or maybe they're additions): I'm "eviling up" the character Obadiah Stone from the first Iron Man movie (Being careful not to make this TOO obvious as the source of inspiration for my PCs).

Because of his background as a jilted lover and inferior brother, I'm also casting him as a person of intense, but warped, emotional need. There are ALWAYS people around him (mostly slaves and the pcs, but also non-slave npcs on occasion-the other knot).

In regard to the players, he's the Obadiah father figure. He's proud of them, he expects the world of them. He expects them to accomplish any task he sets for them (e.g. Make an arc reactor, now please.) Like a good father, he'll punish them if he must, but it is with a "this hurts me more than it hurts you" tone. He wants to be cared for, and since his past has shown that love cannot be encouraged...he's decided that love (non-sexual --He's beyond physical pleasures in his new "state".) must be taken. They WILL love and respect him as their mentor and father.

When the players meet him, Tiadora will treat him as a military commander, but he'll have slaves in various states of servitude... one is kneeling on the floor and serving as his footrest, another is pathetically hugging his arm like it was a teddy bear, and another is engaged in a (wildly one-sided) game of chess with him (and is "punished" whenever Thorn takes a piece...elsewise they'd never learn).


I'm hoping to pull off "fatherly, domineering, congenial, affable man...the sort of man who signs up his son for little league and expects, then demands, that he always win, and win as mvp."

Hope that helps. Any thoughts?

 

[gdmcbride]

I like fleshing out Thorn some more and you seem to be taking him in interesting directions. Yes, he is a cliche' but hopefully one that gets more interesting and developed as the campaign continues. I think you've nailed one of the problems with fleshing him out too much. Thorn is at once an important character to the AP, but also in another sense a minor one. He gets little "screen time" and his presence is mostly felt in absentia. Ultimately, the interesting main characters should be the PCs.

Spoiler

Thorn gets a lot more multi-dimensional in the campaign when he starts protecting Sir Richard the paladin and later might even resurrect him. Thats about the time when he starts to regret the path he's chosen. It can be lonely along the way of the wicked.

Anyways, its always interesting what other people think and do with the campaign. Keep up the updates and thanks for supporting "Way of the Wicked".

Gary McBride
Fire Mountain Games

 

[Aberzanzorax]

Session 2. (SPOILERS APLENTY)

Our session 2 started (as stated above) with Grumblejack charging the drunken weasel Sergeant Blackerly while the pcs held Warden Richter hostage (6 strength and grappled) and walked him forward.

Out of spells and most of the few resources they'd gathered, they resorted to diplomacy and intimidation, with several key speeches and compelling points (emphasized by the points of their swords and a very tiny amount of bloodletting) winning over the warden to the camp of "I'd rather live than die and have these criminals escape anyway".

Grumblejack chases Blackerly to the dog pen, and the Sergeant opens the door, dives in, and shouts "Attack! KILL!" Grumbleajack steps up and closes the door.


There's a race between the remainder of the guard and the players to get to the front gate of the keep, and, in the end, we have an "OJ simpson chase scene"...a lot of very tense, very slow movements out of the keep, with the Warden deeply in harm's way.

Blackerly spends the remainder of the session huddled in the dog pound.

Eventually, the players and the warden get to the outside gate and some very tense negotiation occurs, with the warden tied to the gate and the gate disabled...the PCs on the side of freedom.


The pcs made their way across the moors, found the manor, and were let in. They made good use of the slaves, and were perhaps the least paranoid I've ever seen these players or any pcs when they drank the healing wine and ate the tasty dinners.


Their meeting with Thorn went without a hitch (I played him as suggested) and they seemed (rightly) intimidated by him, and perhaps even liked him. The only issue was the contract and that one of the players is a devotee of Zun Kuthoun (sp)...god of midnight and torture/pain. He was quickly convinced that the contract would not conflict with his own (or his god's) interests (in part by discussing Elise who worships the Winter Godess).

We left off with the usual bookkeeping and levelling up/buying equipment...but they're all sending me emails about what they're doing with their three days of respite.

So far, so good.

 

[ShadowDenizen]

Their meeting with Thorn went without a hitch (I played him as suggested) and they seemed (rightly) intimidated by him, and perhaps even liked him. The only issue was the contract and that one of the players is a devotee of Zun Kuthoun (sp)...god of midnight and torture/pain.

Yes, my players, while not happy about the pact of thorns contract deal went along with it.

The only problem was our Monk, who had ALREADY sold his soul to Asmodeus, and didn’t want this to conflict with his existing pact. I had Thorn pull out the old “Ah, Asmodeus mentioned you specifically” deal. It wasn’t entirely satisfying, but the player was just looking for an “In-Character” excuse to sign. (My players like to stay in-character, but they’re able to meta-game… in a GOOD sense.)

I was originally going to “Hand-wave” the 3-day respite, but given the break-neck pace of the prison escape, I wanted to make this session a bit more-character-driven. So, with the pact signed at the end of Session 1, I shifted gears to mainly introduce the rival Knot this session.

I tweaked/revamped the NPC knot characters involved to have more interaction/sparks with our party.
* I made one of them a female Ranger who had previously apprenticed with our Monk character. (She had previously apprenticed with our PC Monk, and had left (been kicked out) the order. When the PC Monk knew her, she was a bit of a shy, delicate charcter, [I envisoned her orignalyl as very mucj in the vein of Sinead O’Connor for some reason.) But, as a ranger, she’s now much more of a self-assured “Wilcd child”, which the PC Monk seemed to dig. (They’ve also been plotting revenger against their former master, as he is also the one who turned our PC monk in.) I have to find a good spot in an upcoming adventure to insert him.)
* Our PC Antipaladin continued his “Flirting” with Tiadora. I made one of the Knot NPC’s as a stunningly beautiful Barbarian woman. (As mentioned, our antipladin fashoions himself a Ladies Man.) I made the Barbarian woman even more beautiful than Tiadora in her human guise, so there was instant rivaly there, with the Antipaladin caught in the middle.
*”Applejacks” (FKA Grumblejack” continued to be a well-liked Auxiliary Party Member. (He and the Dwarf ended up getting drunk together, which made for quite an entertaining time, though it didn’t endear them to the other Knot at all…)

Interestingly, our Witch was pretty taken with Thorn, though I think she suspects that he’s much more “tortured” than he lets on. (The player of the Witch is a REALLY good judge of charcter, so I probably [unwittingly] gave some tell-tale signs that intrigued her…. She spent A LOT of time with Thorn, which again did NOT ingratiate her with the other Knot.)

The Nine Tests went over pretty well. I tried to evoke a “1E Dungeon-Feel” for this, and most of our players (who are all long-time gamers) appreciated that. Most all of the party was OK with a “Tricks & Traps” based dungeon, and those who weren’t still managed to contribute using their characters’ skills.

 

[Aberzanzorax]

[MENTION=16485]ShadowDenizen[/MENTION] I like what you're doing with the characterization of the other knot.

I think I'll take a page from your book and do a bit of roleplaying next session based upon the goals the players send me over email.

So far, my players are planning:

1. Female inquisitor: to lead services to Asmodeus on a daily basis. It'll be interesting to see how that goes in regard to the other knot.

2. Male necromancer: to spend a lot of time scribing spells and scrolls and to tempt a slave girl to fall deeply in love with him. (His motivation is spurned and untrusted love, similar to Thorn's).

3. Male Oracle: to get to know Grumblejack and the other knot. Mostly doing reconnoissance. No real roleplaying done yet in that regard (over email).

4. Male ranger (worshipper of Zon Kuthon, torturer and serial killer)... Took one slave who "dissappeared". Tiadora noticed and offered some instruction to him. He, not quite sensing what Tiadora is has accepted. We shall see how the instruction goes (and how direct it is).



From your ideas, I think I'll have the inquisitor and Thorn grow close (or the potential...her choice, obviously) given her fanatical devotion to Asmodeus and Thorn as a father figure. This'll give the other knot something to be jealous about. There's also the potential for Trik to share in the services (further complicating the jealosy..."She's not after Thorn, she's after Asmodeus..as we all should be.")

Now I just need to think more upon the interactions between the charming and diplomatic oracle and his (diplomatic) prying into the doings of the other knot and how he and Grumblejack get along.

 

[triqui]

Any ETA on book 4? I'm eager to read it

 

[Aberzanzorax]

Any ETA on book 4? I'm eager to read it

While I'm no insider, [MENTION=49338]gdmcbride[/MENTION] posted this on Paizo's forums on June 22:

I am right now putting the final touches on Book 4. It is my hope to have it done by the end of June. Regardless, the answer is ... real soon!
Chargammon is coming.

http://paizo.com/products/btpy8shj/...e-Wicked-Book-Three-Tears-of-the-Blessed#tabs