D&D 5E Bard/Cleric Build Question/Opinion

[Herbalizer]

Hi, I'm just starting an adventure with an Half-Elf Bard. I will select the Lore College, but since we are only 3 players in this game and we don't have a real healer (Barbarian, Sorcerer, and myself), I am planning to get a single level of Cleric : Life. This should make my heal spells more powerful and it also expands my list of options for spells. I have 16 DEX, 16 CHA, STR 8, INT 10 and I need at least 13 WIS to multiclass ...Since we are only 3, I am expecting to have to be in the middle of fights from time to time and therefore I want to be sturdy enough to withstand such melee attacks (without having to compromise and do a Valor Bard).

Here are the 2 options I am contemplating :

Option A: WIS : 13 (just enough to multiclass) CON : 13 At 5th level, get Resilience (CON) feat and gain +1 and proficiency on CON saves, including concentration checks

PROS :
1. +1HP/level (starting at 5th, that means +5 at 10th level and +15 at 20th)
2. +3 to +6 on All CON saves, including concentration checks (useful against spells that requires a CON saves, and since already proficient with DEX and being immune to charm and sleep from Half-Elf, I'd be pretty much covered from most spells)

CONS:
1. Cannot take advantage of Shield proficiency (since I need a free hand to cast spells)


Option B:
WIS: 14 CON : 12 At 5th get War Caster feat

PROS:
1. Advantage on Concentration checks
2. +2 AC (Can cast spell with a shield - could be more if magical shield)
3. Can cast spells using a reaction on attack of opportunity
4. +1 to all WIS saves and ability checks (perception and insight)
5. +1 spell prepared spell (Since I would already have Bless & Cure Wounds as divine spells, Healing Word & Guiding Bolt as "must own" spells, that extra prepared spell would end up being either Bane, Detect Magic or Shield of Faith)

CONS:
1. Not proficient for CON saves (which is huge)

I'm wondering which option I should pick. I read that the bonuses ( + / - ) were more efficient than advantage and disadvantage, and so the big inconvenient of the War Caster feat compared to Resilience is that I only get ADV on concentration checks and do not have bonuses on other CON saves. The extra HPs I think are easily compensated with a higher AC (+2 or more), so I'm wondering if all the little benefits of Option B outweighs its major drawback in not being proficient for CON saves.

Any input would be appreciated !
Thanks

 

[faria]

If you plan to fight with a weapon, go War Caster. If you plan to focus on casting, pick Resilient CON.

 

[bid]

CONS:
1. Cannot take advantage of Shield proficiency (since I need a free hand to cast spells)

You can use a shield and keep your main hand free, so HP and AC. Since you are a soft target, you shouldn't get any OA use for your weapon/spell.

I believe that even at Wis14, your DC will be too weak for offensive use. This removes guiding bolt and bane from the must have.


Moreover:
- Con13 + Wis13 = 5+5 points
- Con12 + Wis14 = 4+7 points

 

[Herbalizer]

You mean not holding a weapon ?! I guess it could be done ..until I need to defend myself in close combat ..I can't rely exclusively on spells ...we won't always have rests between encounters.

Bane is a CHA save, which is uncommon and at +2, it's only 3 less than the maximum when CHA = 20, and only 1 less than my CHA modifier (CHA=16) for the first 8 levels (since I would get a feat at 4th Bard level instead of ability increase), so it can't be that bad !! ...Unless there is some multiclassing mechanics for DC that I don't get.

I don't understand your points counting : I have a 12 and a 13 to assign and a +1 to distribute since I am an half elf and already spend a +1 on Dex, which is why I can either have 13/13 or 12/14

 

[bid]

You mean not holding a weapon ?! I guess it could be done ..until I need to defend myself in close combat ..I can't rely exclusively on spells ...we won't always have rests between encounters.

You never run out of cantrips. As for the rare higher slot spells, you usually cast them before drawing your weapon. Otherwise you can sheath it when you have to cast.

You thought of how that lower DC will impact you. That's good enough.

The point buy was a brain fart, thanks for the correction.

 

[agreenspan]

Are you allowed point buy or do u have to use standard spread?

8, 15(+1), 12(+1), 8, 13, 15(+2)
Take +1con+1cha @ 4?

As a caster, you always use the highest spell DC you have regardless of multiclassing.

 

[Herbalizer]

Uhm ...That's right ! You can always either draw or sheath ...For some reason I thought I would have to lose a turn if I was equipped with a weapon and shield and wanted to cast a spell ..but like you said, I'm allowed to sheath it and can still use my action to cast a spell (with my now free hand) ..So the next round, I could draw and attack if I wanted ...I guess if I have to cast a spell using a bonus action, it would need to be done before attacking....

In that case, the only real advantage of Option B (Wis 14 & War Caster) is the 1 extra prepared spell, being able to cast spell on AoO (which might not be that useful to be honest) and a +1 on WIS saves, DC, and spell attack bonus (the +1 on skills is useless since I'm a Bard and proficient in pretty much everything ..)

Thanks, this is helping a lot ! I think I'll go with the Resilience Feat and select the 4 cleric prepared spells like this (Bless, Cure Wounds, Healing Word, Guiding Bolt) on most occasions. Sure, Guiding Bolt might not hit as often as if I was using my CHA mod but it's so good, I have to use it !

 

[Herbalizer]

Are you allowed point buy or do u have to use standard spread?


8, 15(+1), 12(+1), 8, 13, 15(+2)
Take +1con+1cha @ 4?

No, we use the standard spread. We were actually allowed to roll a tentative character and take the standard spread if the rolled one sucked too much ..it was my case

As a caster, you always use the highest spell DC you have regardless of multiclassing.

That's not how I read it. You can use slots of any levels to cast spells of a different class than your initial one but it says (on p164 of PHB, under Spellcasting/Spells Known and prepared) that:
"Each spell you know and prepare is associated with one of your classes, and you use the spellcasting ability of that class when you cast the spell."

So I can use a 5th level slot to cast a 1st level Cleric spell even if I only have 1 level of Cleric, but I have to use the spellcasting ability of that class, which is WIS, not CHA

 

[agreenspan]

So take cleric spells which don't use stats. Bane and cure are available to bard. Take protection from good and evil detect magic, shield of faith, etc from cleric.

have you considered taking 8 14 12(+1) 10 13(+1) 15(+2) and just wearing medium armor (CLR proficiency) - taking con/cha @4

 

[mellored]

The DC for ANY spell is 8+your proficiency +the spells casting modifier. Even for a barbarian.

The only thing that changes is the modifier. Wis for cleric spells, Cha for bard spells. You need to keep track of which list you got the spell off of.

Clerics have plenty of spells that don't need a spell casting modifier. Bard's have less, but still some, but they also want Cha for insperation dice. 1/2 damage on a miss spells are also good.