D&D 5E Booming Blade seems a bit powerful

[Ganymede81]

Ah. Existence proof.

Don't jump the gun just yet.

I just found out about Booming Blade and Greenflame Blade a couple days ago. Maybe some spilled Mountain Dew blots out the Eldritch Blast notation on my character sheet. Who knows?

 

[Celtavian]

No, the target cannot move (as in move 5' or more). It has to remain in the same space, but can otherwise fight and cast spells and move around in that space as normal.

http://www.sageadvice.eu/2015/11/10/does-booming-blade-movement-refer-only-to-overland-movement/

Jeremy Crawford [MENTION=4036]Jeremy[/MENTION]ECrawford When booming blade refers to moving, it means movement in the game's normal sense: moving X feet. https://twitter.com/hashtag/DnD?src=hash

Look at that. Already answered.

 

[PnPgamer]

Whoa I have totally dismissed those two cantrips as meh ones. Not anymore thanks to this thread.

 

[Quartz]

Jeremy Crawford [MENTION=4036]Jeremy[/MENTION]ECrawford When booming blade refers to moving, it means movement in the game's normal sense: moving X feet. https://twitter.com/hashtag/DnD?src=hash

That's pretty definitive, then.

 

[Fanaelialae]

I feel that's hyperbole.

To an extent. Hyperbole can be of significant value in illustrating a point. The point being that Booming Blade is so different from other cantrips that it does not make for easy comparison. In my opinion, you're greatly oversimplifying it, only comparing/contrasting limited aspects.

While it wouldn't be a perfect comparison, it is not that difficult to compare and contrast different attack cantrips.

The DMG already informs us that 1d10 damage is a baseline for cantrips; that can be seen in Fire Bolt and Eldritch Blast. We then have Poison Spray, a cantrip where the designers indicated that a drastically reduced range is worth an upgrade to 1d12. Another cantrip, Acid Splash, indicates that the ability to hit adjacent targets is worth a drop to 1d6 damage. It is rough and dirty math, but one could say that combining both elements would result in a baseline damage of 1d8.

Note that these are all ranged cantrips which leverage your spellcasting ability score. Even Poison Spray, which has an extremely short range of 10', does not require you to move adjacent to your target, meaning that you'll often be able to cast it and withdraw without provoking an opportunity attack. (Discounting that Poison Spray is terrible and I've never seen anyone consider it worth taking.)

These spells are not a good basis for comparison because they are ranged. Shocking Grasp might be a better choice, except that it is generally regarded as underpowered. Even then, Shocking Grasp seems oriented towards being able to withdraw safely, which is not what BB and GFB are about.

Greenflame blade, one of the SCAG cantrips and a cantrip meeting the description above, indeed has a 1d8 damage die. On the other hand, it has a number of additional benefits. Chief among them is the ability to do an additional ability modifier of damage to the initial target. Additionally, this cantrip stacks with everything else that would enhance a melee attack: magic weapons, divine strike, sneak attack, battle magic, magic spells, et. al.; other attack cantrips are rarely ever so lucky.

These cantrips require you to be adjacent to your target (5' range). Additionally, they rely on your weapon attack ability score, rather than your spellcasting ability score.

Those are some sweet, sweet bennies for a spell we'd expect to do 1d8 damage per tier.

Arguably, the above limitations are worth those sweet bennies. After all, being in a position to let your opponent hit back ought to be worth something.

 

[Ganymede81]

To an extent. Hyperbole can be of significant value in illustrating a point. The point being that Booming Blade is so different from other cantrips that it does not make for easy comparison. In my opinion, you're greatly oversimplifying it, only comparing/contrasting limited aspects.



Note that these are all ranged cantrips which leverage your spellcasting ability score. Even Poison Spray, which has an extremely short range of 10', does not require you to move adjacent to your target, meaning that you'll often be able to cast it and withdraw without provoking an opportunity attack. (Discounting that Poison Spray is terrible and I've never seen anyone consider it worth taking.)

These spells are not a good basis for comparison because they are ranged. Shocking Grasp might be a better choice, except that it is generally regarded as underpowered. Even then, Shocking Grasp seems oriented towards being able to withdraw safely, which is not what BB and GFB are about.



These cantrips require you to be adjacent to your target (5' range). Additionally, they rely on your weapon attack ability score, rather than your spellcasting ability score.



Arguably, the above limitations are worth those sweet bennies. After all, being in a position to let your opponent hit back ought to be worth something.

Yeah, you made this same point yesterday.

The issue was that I disagreed with it, not that I didn't understand it.

 

[Fanaelialae]

Yeah, you made this same point yesterday.

The issue was that I disagreed with it, not that I didn't understand it.

Fair enough. As I doubt there is anything left from either of us to change the other's position, I'm bowing out of this discussion. Thanks for offering me an alternate perspective on the matter.

 

[Ganymede81]

Fair enough. As I doubt there is anything left from either of us to change the other's position, I'm bowing out of this discussion. Thanks for offering me an alternate perspective on the matter.

It is no problem.

I was half expecting a long post filled with passive-aggressive insults, as is all too common in this forum. Thanks for not doing that.

 

[Xeviat]

The fighter can deal 46 points of damage just by full attacking at level 20. Meaning that, unless the target moves (which is up to the DM, since it has to be willing movement) he's actually hurting his output at level 20 by using BB. It is a moderate damage boost from levels 17 to 19, but for three levels that many campaigns won't even see is it even worth mentioning?

It's about the control, not the damage, though. The fact that it will do 12 more damage than their normal attack routine if the target moves, or only 6 damage less but forcing them to stop, is pretty nice.

 

[Ovinomancer]

It is no problem.

I was half expecting a long post filled with passive-aggressive insults, as is all too common in this forum. Thanks for not doing that.

Like this one?

Well, not exactly like this one. It isn't very long.