D&D 5E Build Help - Dex Based Fighter/Barbarian - Want to do it all

[Tidomann]

Trying to figure out how I want to progress my character. I'm realizing I have to be more of a front liner than I originally thought.

The restrictions are normal 27 point buy, and I must be a Wood Elf.

I'm torn between going straight fighter or 1 fighter/X Barbarian.

How are your feeling between champion/BM as a dex based fighter? How does it contrast to incorporating barbarian? While a lot of the barbarian options specify strength, advantage on initiative, dex saves, and unarmored defense are all very appealing as well as some of the totem options to provide insane defenses with rage.

Is there a way that I can work finesse melee with archery bonuses + ranged while still being a defensive power house? Also. how do dex fighters deal with changing between ranged weapons + melee weapons + shield without eating into too many actions? Of course, just shooting point blank is always an option (apparently we are not imposing disadvantage on shooting in melee, and I believe this is incorporated in crossbow expert), but then I lose out on the benefits of a shield. This is also important as opportunity attacks must be made with a melee weapon. If swapping eats too many actions, feats like sentinel seem to lose a lot of appeal unless I went the two weapon fighting route instead.

 

[Vicaring]

It's perfectly doable, which pisses me off to no end. I want to kick WOTC's ass for making a version of D&D where Strength is a dump-stat, especially for a fighter.

 

[Coyote81]

I always felt like a mixed weapon dex character was doable. Probably something along the line of Fighter 4 (Battlemaster, 4 for the ASI) for a variety of maneuvers that can be used with both melee and ranged. Followed by Barbarian X Totem Follower. This will push you into a very defensive scout type character then can wield a bow in one hand and have a rapier(call it a shortspear for aesthetics). Have the shortspear on your back and fire your bow, when they get into melee range, you can draw the shortspear in your free hand and attack with it as a 1-handed weapon with no penalties. At no point are you ever duel wielding, you only use dex, and a great AC by maxing dex and con, and a variety of tricks from being a battlemaster.

 

[Tidomann]

It's perfectly doable, which pisses me off to no end. I want to kick WOTC's ass for making a version of D&D where Strength is a dump-stat, especially for a fighter.

I definitely get an uneasy feeling depending on how big the discrepancy is. All I know is first session, trying to grapple a fleeing gnome was abysmal, and really made me miss my strength being higher than 13.

I always felt like a mixed weapon dex character was doable. Probably something along the line of Fighter 4 (Battlemaster, 4 for the ASI) for a variety of maneuvers that can be used with both melee and ranged. Followed by Barbarian X Totem Follower. This will push you into a very defensive scout type character then can wield a bow in one hand and have a rapier(call it a shortspear for aesthetics). Have the shortspear on your back and fire your bow, when they get into melee range, you can draw the shortspear in your free hand and attack with it as a 1-handed weapon with no penalties. At no point are you ever duel wielding, you only use dex, and a great AC by maxing dex and con, and a variety of tricks from being a battlemaster.

This definately saves on actions by simply holding the ranged weapon in one hand. Any reason for shortbow compared to longbow/Heavy Crossbow? Is it more just to keep things in check on a flavor level (which I can get behind)? I think this route might be best, and only bringing out the shield when I know I'll be in prolonged melee combat.

 

[Zaruthustran]

For your gnome problem: keep in mind that Rage gives you advantage on all Str checks. Sure, your modifier is low, but at least you get to pick the higher of two rolls.

Viability of Dex Barbarian: certainly doable. Even though Rage's damage bonus is only applicable to Str melee attacks, and Reckless Attack only works with Str melee attacks, the rest of the class's features aren't reliant on Str. You get Rage's DR, Danger Sense, Unarmored Defense, Extra Attack, and your path features. A barbarian with low Str isn't optimal, but it's not terrible.

That said: why go Barbarian at all? If you're into Unarmored Defense, you'd get way more synergy out of mixing Fighter with Monk. And Monk is a perfect fit for Wood Elf.

 

[MindxKiller]

For your gnome problem: keep in mind that Rage gives you advantage on all Str checks. Sure, your modifier is low, but at least you get to pick the higher of two rolls.

Viability of Dex Barbarian: certainly doable. Even though Rage's damage bonus is only applicable to Str melee attacks, and Reckless Attack only works with Str melee attacks, the rest of the class's features aren't reliant on Str. You get Rage's DR, Danger Sense, Unarmored Defense, Extra Attack, and your path features. A barbarian with low Str isn't optimal, but it's not terrible.

That said: why go Barbarian at all? If you're into Unarmored Defense, you'd get way more synergy out of mixing Fighter with Monk. And Monk is a perfect fit for Wood Elf.

I'm imagining that since he's basically making a "tank" he will have higher con than wis and be increasing con before wis with ASI's so he'd get a higher AC out of barb than monk, in addition to the higher hit dice for barb levels and the better con giving a few hit points, as well as rage halving the damage he takes. As for my suggestions, OP, only take 3 levels of barb if you end up taking barb. You'll have more damage potential with fighter 17/barb 3 than barb 19/fighter 1 due to Extra Attack and Action Surge, as well as Maneuvers giving you more damage and more options.

 

[Kithas]

I've never understood the pull to dex in barbarian, so much of the good barbarian stuff outright requires str, Rage damage and reckless attacks being big ones.

If you want to be really tanky and mix range with melee my advice would be fighter/ranger. Ranger is a lot more defensive than it usually gets credit for. Multiattack defense, horde breaker and picking up the defensive style will definitely help. They also get good hp and have no problem dealing with groups.

On the other hand fighter/sorcerer could be rather good as well. It is really hard to get hit if you are concentrating on Blur, and cast Shield whenever something manages to hit you. You could try this with EK but the lack of spell slots will hurt a lot. Draconic ancestry sorc gives you the best light armor(13+dex) and +1hp/level too, so it hp wise acts like a d8 class.

That said tankiness really depends on 2 things, hp and ac. If you get a high con and dex you should be ok.

Edit;
As far as BM vs Champ, BM would definitely be my choice in this situation, the options you get like pushing, menacing and tripping from range are awesome.

 

[pdegan2814]

I've never understood the pull to dex in barbarian, so much of the good barbarian stuff outright requires str, Rage damage and reckless attacks being big ones.

If you want to be really tanky and mix range with melee my advice would be fighter/ranger. Ranger is a lot more defensive than it usually gets credit for. Multiattack defense, horde breaker and picking up the defensive style will definitely help. They also get good hp and have no problem dealing with groups.

On the other hand fighter/sorcerer could be rather good as well. It is really hard to get hit if you are concentrating on Blur, and cast Shield whenever something manages to hit you. You could try this with EK but the lack of spell slots will hurt a lot. Draconic ancestry sorc gives you the best light armor(13+dex) and +1hp/level too, so it hp wise acts like a d8 class.

That said tankiness really depends on 2 things, hp and ac. If you get a high con and dex you should be ok.

Edit;
As far as BM vs Champ, BM would definitely be my choice in this situation, the options you get like pushing, menacing and tripping from range are awesome.

The pull is to maximize the effectiveness of the Barbarian's Unarmored Defense, without having to blow any ASI's on Strength. Yes, you give up some of the benefits of Raging, but your focus as a Dex Barbarian will be more on survivability, and less on inflicting the most damage possible. With a rapier and a shield, and 16s as your starting values for Dex & Con, you can have the same AC as chain mail, but with no disadvantage on Stealth checks, and you're still able to Rage. At level 8 you'd have the same AC as plate mail, again with no Stealth disadvantage and no Rage restriction. Plus, you're maximizing the effectiveness of your Danger Sense and Feral Instinct.

Does the AC bonus from a Draconic bloodline stack with the Unarmored Defense of the Barbarian? Would your AC be 13+Dex+Con, or still 10+Dex+Con? On the one hand, the Unarmored Defense working explicitly says 10+Dex+Con, but the Draconic Resilience doesn't appear to say you're considered to be "wearing armor".

 

[Kithas]

That's fair, it just doesn't seem worth more than 2 levels. For draconic resilience it is a choice, either 13+dex or 10+dex+con, you cannot get both, 13+dex should honestly be plenty as that maxes out at plate mail and you can use a shield with it.

 

[Coyote81]

The pull is to maximize the effectiveness of the Barbarian's Unarmored Defense, without having to blow any ASI's on Strength. Yes, you give up some of the benefits of Raging, but your focus as a Dex Barbarian will be more on survivability, and less on inflicting the most damage possible. With a rapier and a shield, and 16s as your starting values for Dex & Con, you can have the same AC as chain mail, but with no disadvantage on Stealth checks, and you're still able to Rage. At level 8 you'd have the same AC as plate mail, again with no Stealth disadvantage and no Rage restriction. Plus, you're maximizing the effectiveness of your Danger Sense and Feral Instinct.

Does the AC bonus from a Draconic bloodline stack with the Unarmored Defense of the Barbarian? Would your AC be 13+Dex+Con, or still 10+Dex+Con? On the one hand, the Unarmored Defense working explicitly says 10+Dex+Con, but the Draconic Resilience doesn't appear to say you're considered to be "wearing armor".

Currently the only thing that stacks with it would be the +Int to AC from Blasesinger, which I thought would be an intersting idea, but you'd lose your ability to wield a shield. Which kind of offsets the purpose of adding to your AC in the first place.