Converting prehistoric animals

[demiurge1138]

The mastodon was in MMIII.

Frankly, the wooly mammoth is my favorite, because it has the toss mechanic, which I love. It gets improved grab on its gore, but only so it can make an immediate opposed bull's rush to a "grappled" creature without it moving. Goring people and throwing 'em around... that's what fantasy elephants are all about.

 

[RavinRay]

Ok, I haven't seen all the stats yet, but from what demiurge just said, proboscideans with more closely spaced and straighter tusks are more likely to have improved grab and toss because the animal has a better chance of scooping up an opponent with the tusks.

 

[Shade]

Mastodon (Huge, 15 HD): Abilities: Str 32, Dex 11, Con 23, Int 2, Wis 10, Cha 5; slam and 2 stamps or gore; SA trample; SQ scent.

Grizzly Mastodon (Huge, 15 HD): Abilities: Str 35, Dex 10, Con 23, Int 2, Wis 15, Cha 7; slam, 2 stamps and gore; SA trample; SQ scent.

Mammoth (Huge, 14 HD): Abilities: Str 34, Dex 8, Con 25, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 7; ; slam and 2 stamps or gore; SA improved grab, toss, trample; SQ scent.

Dire Elephant (Gargantuan, 20 HD): Str 40, Dex 11, Con 30, Int 2, Wis 15, Cha 7; slam and 2 stamps or gore; SA trample; SQ scent.

Elephant (Huge, 11 HD): Abilities: Str 30, Dex 10, Con 21, Int 2, Wis 13, Cha 7; slam and 2 stamps or gore; SA trample; SQ scent.

 

[Shade]

And while we're on the subject, we might as well look ahead to the remaining unconverted Proboscideans, like Ambelodon. I'll see if there are any others still unconverted.

 

[demiurge1138]

Ok, I haven't seen all the stats yet, but from what demiurge just said, proboscideans with more closely spaced and straighter tusks are more likely to have improved grab and toss because the animal has a better chance of scooping up an opponent with the tusks.

Actually, I think it's really more the case of one designer thought the mechanic was cool, and it got into Frostburn despite never being used before or ever again, but that's just my take

 

[freyar]

Ok, sounds like we like extended reach, imp grab, and toss for the gore, but how else should we distinguish these. The stats Shade posted above are all pretty similar, so I don't know how we want to distinguish this one.

 

[demiurge1138]

These are forest-dwelling creatures, yes?

For my World of Kong project, the following SQs may be applicable:


Jungle Movement (Ex): Venatosauruses have supreme agility and maneuverability despite their size, allowing them to pass through the thickest jungle with ease. A venatosaurus can move through light undergrowth without penalty, and treats heavy undergrowth as light undergrowth for the purposes of movement (two squares to pass through, +2 to Tumble and Move Silently DCs).

Narrow Berth (Ex): Due to its narrow body, an asperdorsus is treated as being two sizes smaller than it actually is for the purposes of squeezing (see page 149 of the Player’s Handbook for the rules for squeezing).

The asperdorsus was Gargantuan. Anacus isn't that skinny, so for narrow berth we'd probably make them count as Large.

 

[RavinRay]

Yes, Anancus was a forest dweller. If I may digress at this point, grazers (grass-eaters) have lamellar teeth for grinding silica-bearing grass while browsers (leaf-eaters) have molars with blunt points for shredding leaves. Anancus was the former. It died out when the forests started regressing with the spread of grasslands.

Whatever the designer in mind thought about toss, it's good. Those forest abilities look really cool, we can modify them for this beast.

 

[freyar]

I also like those forest abilities from demiurge. But we still need to figure out stats, and, honestly, I don't know how Anancus should compare to the others...

 

[Shade]

Yeah, those forest abilities are great! And a resounding yes to toss.

Leaving off the standard elephant and looking at the scores of the three Huge relatives, we get a range of Str 32-35, Dex 8-11, Con 23-25, Int 2, Wis 10-15, Cha 5-7.

Since they were supposedly closest to mammoths, I'd lean closer to those stats.

Maybe Str 34, Dex 10, Con 23, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 7?

That's slightly better Dex to account for needing to manuever through the forest, and slightly less Con due to the more forgiving environment.