D&D 5E Crawford on Stealth

[Maxperson]

I'm not going to be discuss the definition of "uncertainty" with you.

To understand my viewpoint, to the extent you desire to do so, you have to view the uncertainty as existing at the level of the fiction. And the mechanic - an ability check or a passive check - resolves that uncertainty.

So, the player states a goal and approach. I don't know whether that succeeds or fails, so there is uncertainty as to the outcome. I set a DC and decide on an ability check or a passive check. Then I resolve the uncertainty into an outcome and narrate.

How is that different from the uncertainty existing at the level of fiction, which I assume means that the PC doesn't know if it will succeed or fail, and you deciding outright that the PC succeeds or fails? Or are you saying that the PC knows whether the action will auto succeed or fail, but the player doesn't and that's why the player stated he was going to try the action?

Edit: I'm also not sure how the bolded changes it, either. Presumably, you didn't know whether the PC would auto succeed or fail at something prior to the player stating that he tries the action, so you are resolving uncertainty that way as well.

 

[iserith]

How is that different from the uncertainty existing at the level of fiction, which I assume means that the PC doesn't know if it will succeed or fail, and you deciding outright that the PC succeeds or fails? Or are you saying that the PC knows whether the action will auto succeed or fail, but the player doesn't and that's why the player stated he was going to try the action?

Edit: I'm also not sure how the bolded changes it, either. Presumably, you didn't know whether the PC would auto succeed or fail at something prior to the player stating that he tries the action, so you are resolving uncertainty that way as well.

I don't understand your questions. I'll make one last pass at the adjudication method I use and perhaps that will make clear why I think a passive check against a static DC is fine:

1. DM describes the environment.
2. Player describes what he or she wants to do.

- If DM thinks it succeeds, it succeeds.
- If DM thinks it fails, it fails.
- If DM isn't sure, DM sets a DC and choose appropriate mechanic to resolve. Passive check is for a task being done repeatedly. Otherwise, it's an ability check.

3. DM narrates the result of the adventurer's action.

 

[Maxperson]

I don't understand your questions. I'll make one last pass at the adjudication method I use and perhaps that will make clear why I think a passive check against a static DC is fine:

1. DM describes the environment.
2. Player describes what he or she wants to do.

- If DM thinks it succeeds, it succeeds.
- If DM thinks it fails, it fails.
- If DM isn't sure, DM sets a DC and choose appropriate mechanic to resolve. Passive check is for a task being done repeatedly. Otherwise, it's an ability check.

3. DM narrates the result of the adventurer's action.

I was confused by what you were saying since you said it was from at the level of fiction viewpoint. The players and DM exists outside of the fiction, so aren't at that level. I take the last sentence to mean that you do in fact use random rolls to resolve ability checks. Is that correct? Because it sounded from those prior posts with [MENTION=6795602]FrogReaver[/MENTION] like you were not using rolls for ability checks.

 

[iserith]

I was confused by what you were saying since you said it was from at the level of fiction viewpoint. The players and DM exists outside of the fiction, so aren't at that level. I take the last sentence to mean that you do in fact use random rolls to resolve ability checks. Is that correct? Because it sounded from those prior posts with [MENTION=6795602]FrogReaver[/MENTION] like you were not using rolls for ability checks.

I use rolls for ability checks and no rolls for passive checks. Whether or not an ability check or a passive check is appropriate depends on what the player says in Step 2.

Passive checks are not as common as ability checks.

 

[Maxperson]

I use rolls for ability checks and no rolls for passive checks. Whether or not an ability check or a passive check is appropriate depends on what the player says in Step 2.

Passive checks are not as common as ability checks.

Okay. Then I misunderstood that conversation. My apologies.