pukunui
Legend
This is what I'd go for.
D&D 5E Current take on GWM/SS
Delandel
First Post
That's a very interesting question.
My initial response would be, "about as much as a +2 ASI to your damage-dealing stat." So for example, a feat that increases a barbarian's damage should be, in my opinion, roughly equal to a +1 to hit and damage, however much that boost is worth on average.
A solution I'd like to try one day is to change the +10 to +one weapon die.
That's a lot less than +10 but it seems like a more reasonable amount. It would also favor greataxe over greatsword since it's established that "one weapon die" on a 2d6 weapon means 1d6. That asymmetry seems to fit the flavor of this feat, plus greataxe needs all the help it can get.
Maybe at 11th level it becomes +two weapon dice or something, to remain relevant at higher levels. I haven't fully thought that through.
That's a lot less than +10 but it seems like a more reasonable amount. It would also favor greataxe over greatsword since it's established that "one weapon die" on a 2d6 weapon means 1d6. That asymmetry seems to fit the flavor of this feat, plus greataxe needs all the help it can get.
Maybe at 11th level it becomes +two weapon dice or something, to remain relevant at higher levels. I haven't fully thought that through.
Where is that established - the 1d6 weapon dice for a greatsword? Not saying you're wrong, but I would like to see the source for that.
iserith
Magic Wordsmith
I find balance is only important as it relates to sharing the spotlight and given that there are three pillars in the game - not just the one - not everyone needs to be equal when it comes to damage output.
Well it hasn't been addressed in Sage Advice yet, so the most authoritative statement we have is from the esteemed Rodney Thompson:
https://twitter.com/AntarianRanger/status/487006879160102913
Other analysis:
http://community.wizards.com/forum/rules-questions/threads/4145026
http://community.wizards.com/forum/rules-questions/threads/4116466
Carefully re-reading the bit on Damage Rolls (PHB p.196) and Weapons (PHB p.146) I can't find anything to suggest that 2d6 could be considered a single damage "die." In previous editions it was definitely treated this way (in 4E, 1[W] could refer to multiple dice in some cases, and in 3E, 2d6 was part of a weapon damage progression when increasing weapon sizes), but the most straightforward and literal interpretation in 5E, is that a die is a die is a die, and 2d6 is two dice.
Plus, ask your fighter friend with Great Weapon Fighting fighting style and a greatsword, whether he wants to reroll 1s and 2s on both damage dice, or on a single 2d6 damage "die." Everybody I've seen does the former, which is a tremendous benefit to greatswords, so it's only fair to be consistent when applying rules that grant "one additional damage die," even if that works against greatswords.
Thanks, I googled it and found a good thread on rpg.stackexchange with good counter arguments. I won't derail this thread over it.
I wish we could focus this mostly on DMs. Players rarely want to give up power. Though it is nice to know at least the community is fairly split with 54% wanting to do something about the feat and 46% wanting to leave it as is.
I imagine it's the group with optimizers that see the problems the feats cause. I know the problem is rather narrow. It's the ability to focus fire using multiple attacks with Sharpshooter or Great Weapon Master often in combination with an ability like Action Surge, haste, or Smiting that is the primary cause of the problem. As a DM I don't mind when the players can take down multiples faster, in those circumstances I like GWM and Sharpshooter at full strength. When a party is fighting a single powerful monster or NPC supposedly strong enough to challenge them alone, and GWM and Sharpshooter double the damage on the target on top of everyone else novaing while buffed to the gills creates a very anticlimactic battle. There have been multiple instances where the players have taken a fight and turned it trivial due to those two feats doubling the damage of an Action Surging fighter or increased the damage by about 30% per hit for a smiting paladin. Even might dragons go down quick to this damage, creatures less powerful than dragons go down in a round of two. I recall fighting a supposedly strong single target non-legendary creature and a supposedly powerful priest using a legendary artifact, the fights lasted 6 to 12 seconds due to GWF and Sharpshooter damage. A lot of caster enemies are fairly easy to hit and have low hit points making these feats particularly effective against such enemies.
Given this narrow situation for their abuse, I can see why there are still quite a few that don't see the problem with them. I hope as time goes by, more will see it.
I imagine it's the group with optimizers that see the problems the feats cause. I know the problem is rather narrow. It's the ability to focus fire using multiple attacks with Sharpshooter or Great Weapon Master often in combination with an ability like Action Surge, haste, or Smiting that is the primary cause of the problem. As a DM I don't mind when the players can take down multiples faster, in those circumstances I like GWM and Sharpshooter at full strength. When a party is fighting a single powerful monster or NPC supposedly strong enough to challenge them alone, and GWM and Sharpshooter double the damage on the target on top of everyone else novaing while buffed to the gills creates a very anticlimactic battle. There have been multiple instances where the players have taken a fight and turned it trivial due to those two feats doubling the damage of an Action Surging fighter or increased the damage by about 30% per hit for a smiting paladin. Even might dragons go down quick to this damage, creatures less powerful than dragons go down in a round of two. I recall fighting a supposedly strong single target non-legendary creature and a supposedly powerful priest using a legendary artifact, the fights lasted 6 to 12 seconds due to GWF and Sharpshooter damage. A lot of caster enemies are fairly easy to hit and have low hit points making these feats particularly effective against such enemies.
Given this narrow situation for their abuse, I can see why there are still quite a few that don't see the problem with them. I hope as time goes by, more will see it.
UngeheuerLich
Legend
GWM is ok in Not combined with polarm master. Sharpshooter is ok in Not combined es with crossbow expert.
If IT World Not Work on Bonus Action attacks IT Would help.
If IT World Not Work on Bonus Action attacks IT Would help.
