Divine, Cosmic, Transcendental, and Omnific abilities.

[Sykyrys]

Praetorian Template

I'd personally give each pantheon the ability to collectively and freely grant 16 members of their pantheon the praetorian template. This would require a majority rule and it could be similarly revoked.

<style type="text/css"> <!-- @page { margin: 0.79in } P { margin-bottom: 0.08in } --> </style><style type="text/css"> <!-- @page { margin: 0.79in } P { margin-bottom: 0.08in } --> </style> Praetorian

“Praetorian” is a template that can be added to any immortal, sidereal, or eternal (referred to hereafter as the base creature).

A praetorian has all the base creatures statistics and special abilities, except, as noted here.

Special Attacks: The praetorian retains all the base creature's special attacks and gains those describe below.

- Karmic [Effect], Siphoning [Effect] (Su): A praetorian gains Karmic [Effect] and Siphoning [Effect] as bonus cosmic abilities.

Special Qualities: The praetorian retains all the base creature's special qualities and gains those describe below.

- Elusion, Exclusivity, Inner Eye, and Slipstream (Var.): A praetorian gains Elusion, Exclusivity, Inner Eye, and Slipstream as a bonus cosmic abilities. A praetorian must meet the prerequisites for each ability.

Abilities: A praetorian gains +72 to it's ability scores.

Divine Abilities (Var.): A praetorian gains extra divine abilities equal to it's divine rank.

Challenge Rating: Same as base creature +44 (+5/9 per divine rank) (with equipment) or +29 (+10/27 per divine rank) (without equipment).

Level Adjustment: Same as base creature +66 (+5/6 per divine rank) (with equipment) or +44 (+5/9 per divine rank) (without equipment).

 

[Upper_Krust]

hey there!

Don't get me wrong, but even as easily sidetracked as you are and as busy as your life is. I can't help but notice (looking back at old threads) that ever since 4E came out there has been little to no progress or even interest in progress regarding epic level material.

It's like 4E came out, everyone got excited for a few months, then...

...crickets.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's 4E's fault, but I tend to think that many people were either more in favor of 3E or 3E just made game design more fun for most of the people visiting these threads. I'd personally like to see people creating and posting 3E material and 4E material side by side.

I can see what you're saying and I agree to an extent. However there are a number of reasons.

- 4E has divided the market to some degree
- 4E has epic as standard built in (and its pretty good), allowing battles with demigods and demon princes.
- 4E has a hard cap (Level 30) and taking things above that requires a massive amount of work, because unlike 3E you can't just add levels, you need to create new powers and so forth.
- 4E is quicker to design for, but I think its harder to design 'well' (because it has more tactical aspects to consider).

Example...Someone creates a template for 4E. They should create the same template for 3.5. Instead of bickering (which I've seen a lot of during my lengthy lurking period) and complaining about lack of epic material, people should just create it and share to pump up that creative spark.

There are a number of excellent designers here on your threads Krusty and in spite of their differences and perpetual ego bruising (some members more guilty than others, some not guilty at all), they all created a few interesting gems for my campaign.

I think there is a 'bookful' of material on these forums created by the posters. You just have to hunt about for it.

I think the Design An Epic Monster competition really got the creative juices flowing. I'll probably have something like that again later this year.

Even that obnoxious Dante guy was useful (he just needed a bit of prozac or something).

I hope Dante is well, wish him the best, he was a colourful character.

For those of you who remember Anubis (for those unfamiliar, sort of an Elite version of Dante, if you'll pardon the expression), I still talk to Anubis every other month or so. 'Anubis is still Anubis'...is probably the best way of putting that.

Some of my favorite things on these threads include the superior half-dragon, the revised paragon, various divine abilities that were noted, the various epic, etc. dragons, and of course my absolute favorite...

...DEATH.

Although admittedly he was on the wiki thingie.

Lots of cool stuff on these forums. If only I can start getting them to design for 4E.

Also, for those interested in undead-related feats, check out the World of Warcraft books. There are feats that let undead use their Charisma score in lieu of their Constitution score for both hit points and Fortitude saves.

Funny you mention warcraft...I'll have a story indirectly about that in a few weeks time. No I haven't started playing Warcraft, never will don't worry, couldn't afford the time. This is something to do with a possible competition...actually had it typed up there, but deleted it to avoid spoiling the surprise.

 

[Khisanth the Ancient]

or 3E just made game design more fun for most of the people visiting these threads.

I can only speak for myself, but... definitely yes. 3.x design had way more options, way more possibilities, way more complexity, way more fiddly bits - in general way more fun. Making a monster in 4e is kind of boring since once you pick the Level, "status" (minion, normal, Elite, Solo), and role so much other stuff is decided for you. It's still interesting, but not nearly as fun as 3.5e monster making.

I'd personally like to see people creating and posting 3E material and 4E material side by side.

I plan to do this with stuff I make, if it can be done - like my Putron Abomination in the Design an Epic Monster thread. Some of the stuff I'm working on won't work well in 4e (due to the more limited design space) but those that will, will get 4e versions on the threads.

 

[Upper_Krust]

hey Khisanth matey!

I can only speak for myself, but... definitely yes. 3.x design had way more options, way more possibilities, way more complexity, way more fiddly bits - in general way more fun. Making a monster in 4e is kind of boring since once you pick the Level, "status" (minion, normal, Elite, Solo), and role so much other stuff is decided for you. It's still interesting, but not nearly as fun as 3.5e monster making.

See I disagree with that. The fiddly bits (to me anyway) were never fun. Theres nothing in 3E I cannot replicate in 4E with powers. It just removes all the (often useless) fiddly bits and gets down to the crux of the monster.

 

[Sykyrys]

The fiddly bits (to me anyway) were never fun. Theres nothing in 3E I cannot replicate in 4E with powers. It just removes all the (often useless) fiddly bits and gets down to the crux of the monster.

This just boils down to a matter of personal preference and perspective. It's a bit like two people arguing about cannelloni vs. linguine. Both have their merits, but neither is perfect.

I kinda see 4E as the lazy man's D&D, it allows for simplified combat so emphasis can be on combat. Whereas 3E is more complex and allows for more options in non-combat scenarios.

It really just depends on your style of play, neither system is truly better than the other. Of course everyone has their own preference and will likely defend that preference.

I myself prefer 3.5, but to each their own. I'm more than happy to have 4E material being mass produced if it means more 3.5 material can be derived from it's basic concepts.

The only thing I'm not pleased with is the fact that WOTC didn't continue to create 3.5 material when there were so many books they had planned, but never made.

Examples...The Book of Perfect Balance, Fiendish Codex III (yugoloths), etc.

They really alienated a lot of consumers when they made the switch so suddenly. Consumers invested in countless books and WOTC made a money-grab.

Of course this is understandable when you consider that WOTC is really just a corporation looking out for it's own interests.

Anyway, I'm babbling again. Let's get back to design before someone takes offense and this derails into one of those legendary edition flame wars.

 

[Sykyrys]

For those that like lots of class-related abilities but just don't quite have the HD. They're definitely in the cosmic tier, so they're pricey.

I remember a double-double being a triple, so Greater Gestalt just gives you an additional set of Gestalt. These might be useful for those seeking to have multiclass characters, but don't want to give up full level progression to do it.


New Cosmic Abilities


Gestalt (Ex)
You gain gestalt class levels.
Benefit: You gain gestalt class levels equal to your class levels/integrated class levels.


Greater Gestalt (Ex)
You gain even more gestalt class levels.
Benefit: You gain gestalt class levels equal to your class levels/integrated class levels x2.


Greater Integration (Ex)
Your integrated class levels equal your racial Hit Dice.
Benefit: Your integrated class levels equal your racial Hit Dice.

 

[Khisanth the Ancient]

I keep telling myself that one of these days, I'm going to sit down and top Death by making stats for Tetragrammaton or Domodon-Doxomedon. It has yet to happen, but I haven't lost the desire to do so.

I still need to do the stats for Xanou, the dead dimension (who will show up in the "Great Wall is Broken" thread) - who I believe I mentioned would be 'the most powerful Undead ever statted'. (CR somewhere in the low 300s probably)

 

[Alzrius]

I still need to do the stats for Xanou, the dead dimension (who will show up in the "Great Wall is Broken" thread) - who I believe I mentioned would be 'the most powerful Undead ever statted'. (CR somewhere in the low 300s probably)

Hm, I think I may actually have you beat there, simply because Death is also a creature with the Undead type, and his CR is in the high 300's.

 

[Khisanth the Ancient]

Hm, I think I may actually have you beat there, simply because Death is also a creature with the Undead type, and his CR is in the high 300's.

Oh, OK.

I'm not actually sure what Xanou's CR will turn out to be, as I'm not great at judging at those superhigh levels.

 

[Sykyrys]

***moved***