Druid Animal companion..another question from a n00b

[billd91]

Nope, you just summon crazy creatures with no metamagic style adjustment in spell level. I believe the feat was at one point intended to be as you say, but it certainly wasn't written that way, or errata'd later to be that way. Thus, you can toss out a greenbound wolf at first level, and have it throw out a wall of thorns, because the world is occasionally ridiculous. Aberration wild shape might actually be even more ridiculous, at least at the level you get it. It's hard to beat combining nilshai form from unapproachable east with enhance wild shape from the spell compendium, granting two spells every round. It's not like that's the only crazy form either.

I doubt it was ever intended to raise the level of the summoning spell. But one thing to keep in mind is that any greenbound creature summoned by the summon nature's ally spell is generally going to attack as best it can. That's what summoned creatures do. You need to be able to communicate with it in order for it to do anything more sophisticated, like use the wall of thorns spell-like ability. For most druid characters, that wouldn't be too hard, but it's not something nature's allies just do because it's tactically best to do right now - they need to be directed in a way they understand.

 

[eggynack]

I doubt it was ever intended to raise the level of the summoning spell.

Just something I've heard. Don't really have a citation for it, though I suppose I should probably go looking for one at some point.

But one thing to keep in mind is that any greenbound creature summoned by the summon nature's ally spell is generally going to attack as best it can. That's what summoned creatures do. You need to be able to communicate with it in order for it to do anything more sophisticated, like use the wall of thorns spell-like ability. For most druid characters, that wouldn't be too hard, but it's not something nature's allies just do because it's tactically best to do right now - they need to be directed in a way they understand.

The general argument in favor of greenbound being used in this way is that wall of thorns is actually an attack, and if it is one, and it's the best possible action the summons can take, then using it is attacking to the best of its abilities. As some supporting examples, you can look to places like the PHB page 177, where it talks about magical attacks, as well as deducing the exact nature of an attack where the attack is magical. For a more specific definition, you can use the one from invisibility, which definitely includes wall of thorns. Granted, the more general glossary definition only includes stuff with attack rolls, but it's not all that clear that that's what's being referred to in the text of SNA.

 

[scottys72]

Were did you see the level adjustment for the Magebrred Ghost tiger? I see where it says you can take this in place of the dire lion. So shouldnt it be a -9 levels? So if I still have the two same feats I would be considered a lvl 17 druid (11 levels in druid, +3 Natural Bond, +3 Improved Animal Companion), so only +8 effective class level?

Sorry I just want to make sure I do this right.

Thanks!

 

[eggynack]

Were did you see the level adjustment for the Magebrred Ghost tiger? I see where it says you can take this in place of the dire lion. So shouldnt it be a -9 levels? So if I still have the two same feats I would be considered a lvl 17 druid (11 levels in druid, +3 Natural Bond, +3 Improved Animal Companion), so only +8 effective class level?

It says that you have to be 7th level, which means an adjustment of -6.

 

[scottys72]

Thanks again. I am starting to get this. I am keeping the two previously mentioned feats and not going with Greenbound (I think it is to OP) so I am upgrading the cat.

So far I have:

HD 12D8 +60 (48 normally but I up'd the con with level bonus's)
Stats: Str 30 Dex 20 Con 20 Int 2 Wis 12 Char 6
Ac 26 (-1 Size, +5 Dex, 11 Natural) touch 16, Flat-footed 20 I might have screwed up the touch and flat-footed
Attack/Grapple: +11/+22
Attack: Claw +11 (1d8+10)
Full Attack: 2 claws +11 melee (1d8+10) and bite +6 melee(2d6+5)

I am not sure if I did the attacks right or not...

Thanks man

 

[billd91]

You really need to sit down with your DM to go over this stuff. I assume he's OK with the 3rd party/netbook feat that is Improved Animal Companion? Frankly, I'd be quite dubious about it since it not only stacks with itself it allows the druid to pick up an animal companion with a power that exceeds his normal level and that's entering dangerous territory.

Take a closer look at Natural Bond as well. You can't use it to increase your effective druid level above your character level. So while it's great for druids who multiclass because it allows their animal companion to compensate for levels taken in other classes, it won't help you exceed your druid level in animal companion power. I'm not sure exactly what value you're getting out of it.

Also, that magebred ghost tiger seems to have an editing problem. The text at http://eberronunlimited.wikidot.com/magebred-ghost-tiger says the druid needs to be 7th level (so that would say a -6 adjustment for the animal companion), it also says it may be taken in place of a dire lion, which has a -9 and that means 10th level druid. Talk to your DM to resolve that ambiguity.

 

[eggynack]

Ac 26 (-1 Size, +5 Dex, 11 Natural) touch 16, Flat-footed 20 I might have screwed up the touch and flat-footed

Your AC seems off by one, to start with, as you didn't take the size modifier into account. Your flat-footed AC stays the same, and your touch AC goes down by two.

Attack/Grapple: +11/+22

The attack should have a +2 from strength, and a +5 from BAB, leaving you at +18. Grapple should be altered upwards by the same amount, leaving you at +29.

Attack: Claw +11 (1d8+10)
Full Attack: 2 claws +11 melee (1d8+10) and bite +6 melee(2d6+5)

Seems accurate enough, aside from the aforementioned attack bonus issue.

Take a closer look at Natural Bond as well. You can't use it to increase your effective druid level above your character level. So while it's great for druids who multiclass because it allows their animal companion to compensate for levels taken in other classes, it won't help you exceed your druid level in animal companion power. I'm not sure exactly what value you're getting out of it.

Using higher level animal companions reduces your effective druid level for the purposes of animal companions below your actual druid level. Natural bond raises it back up by three. Doesn't do anything with first level companions, but works fine for anything above that.

 

[billd91]

Using higher level animal companions reduces your effective druid level for the purposes of animal companions below your actual druid level. Natural bond raises it back up by three. Doesn't do anything with first level companions, but works fine for anything above that.

Ah, I see where you're going with it.