Dwarf and poison.

[ferratus]

Sean K. Reynolds wrote a nice piece a while back as to why absolute mechanics, particularly immunities, are stupid. It's still true. Just give them a save bonus and be done with it.

I am skeptical if even you are willing to take it as far as Sean K. Reynolds did though. After all, he is going after some pretty sacred cows there as far as spells and spellcasting go, and even to the point of making fire elementals possible to damage with fire.

 

[frankthedm]

Sleep and Charm are not as common as poison tends to be in the D&D opponent roster. But full immunity are a bit much IMHO.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

You could argue that resistance against poison (i.e. granting advantage on safes) is enough.

 

[werecorpse]

I dislike the idea of immunity to poison ( and the immunity to sleep etc) especially at 1st level - for all the reasons Sean Reynolds mentioned in his article and some of the ones mentioned here. Plus it lessens the ability to use a scalable mechanic such as

1st level : advantage to rolls vs poisons
4th level : double con bonus ( instead of single ) or maybe just straight +5 to saves against poison
8 th level : immune to disadvantage from rolls vs poisons
Etc

Immunity is boring, keep the risk in the game even if you reduce it

 

[Plane Sailing]

So what im seeing is that rogue dwarfs are severely overpowered. Rogues are usually the trap finders and such, unlocking doors etc. Well traps usually involve some sort of poison, a favorite among DMs are poison pins when a lock fails. It just seems unbalanced.

Doesn't even need a dwarf rogue! Just get a dwarf to open the chest if you suspect poison. Heck, they ar tough little guys, just get them to open the chest regardless!

 

[Campbell]

Note: Post contains spoiler for monster and magic item mechanics. Might ruin player's experience with Caves of Chaos adventure.

For better or worse I'm seeing a strong undercurrent of bringing the awesome even at low levels here from both PCs and monsters. Abilities that would normally be the province of much higher level games or were unheard of in previous editions are present.

• 2nd level rogues get low light vision after a minute of adjustment.
• 2nd level fighters get to make 2 actions on their turn twice a day.
• Turn Undead stops all undead within 20 feet of you who fail a Wisdom save dead in their tracks - no limit. Can be extended with your action.
• Spells that turn the tide of battle dramatically.
• Protection From Undead bars undead who fail a DC 18 Wisdom save from the area for an hour.
• Potion of Strength grants the imbiber 18 strength for an hour.
• Trolls that regenerate 10 hp a round.
• Wights take 1/2 damage from all weapons that aren't silvered or magical. And can reduce your max hp by 3 on each claw attack with 2 attacks per round.
• Owlbear hug. That is all.

It looks like they are really seeking to ratchet up the wahoo factor of the game. I think its fair to judge the Dwarf's poison immunity with all that in mind.

 

[Dire Bare]

Note: Post contains spoiler for monster and magic item mechanics. Might ruin player's experience with Caves of Chaos adventure.

For better or worse I'm seeing a strong undercurrent of bringing the awesome even at low levels here from both PCs and monsters. Abilities that would normally be the province of much higher level games or were unheard of in previous editions are present.

• 2nd level rogues get low light vision after a minute of adjustment.
• 2nd level fighters get to make 2 actions on their turn twice a day.
• Turn Undead stops all undead within 20 feet of you who fail a Wisdom save dead in their tracks - no limit. Can be extended with your action.
• Spells that turn the tide of battle dramatically.
• Protection From Undead bars undead who fail a DC 18 Wisdom save from the area for an hour.
• Potion of Strength grants the imbiber 18 strength for an hour.
• Trolls that regenerate 10 hp a round.
• Wights take 1/2 damage from all weapons that aren't silvered or magical. And can reduce your max hp by 3 on each claw attack with 2 attacks per round.
• Owlbear hug. That is all.

It looks like they are really seeking to ratchet up the wahoo factor of the game. I think its fair to judge the Dwarf's poison immunity with all that in mind.

Thanks for putting this "debate" in context (if by "debate", I mean several people shouting badwrongfun at each other rather than actually discussing a mechanic). I personally love the dwarven immunity to poison, and the elven immunity to sleep/charm! And the whole wahoo! nature of D&D Next so far!

Wahoo!

 

[triqui]

One thing I do not understand, is why Poison Inmune Dwarves get so attention and that much debate, while Sleep and Charm Inmune Elves do not. Are elves "special" and deserve inmunities, while dwarves do not?

 

[Ahnehnois]

I am skeptical if even you are willing to take it as far as Sean K. Reynolds did though. After all, he is going after some pretty sacred cows there as far as spells and spellcasting go, and even to the point of making fire elementals possible to damage with fire.

You are right that the fire resistance for fire elementals is not to my taste, but dwarves are not poison elementals. Also, most of his many suggestions do make sense.

 

[Plane Sailing]

One thing I do not understand, is why Poison Inmune Dwarves get so attention and that much debate, while Sleep and Charm Inmune Elves do not. Are elves "special" and deserve inmunities, while dwarves do not?

Probably because poison is a much more common threat to PCs than sleep and charm. I bet that the small bonus traditionally given to elves against those threats rarely comes in games (how many things have charm and sleep? Ogre Mage used to have sleep, several fey had charm... probably an order of magnitude less than poison based threats!)

Cheers