Ends justifying the means

[Bedrockgames]

Meh.
All a woman has to do is simply claim abuse and she automatically receives pity and automatically paints the male in a negative light, no matter if she is telling the truth or not.

i agree we have to be careful here, because it is entirely possible for a woman to murder her husband and claim abuse even if he hasn't done anything....but this case has alot to suggest she was abused, he posed a threat to the daughter and he was genealy a dangerous person. It also did go to trial and she was convicted, so it wasn't like charges were dismissed. My take home from that is the court was basically saying the state doesn't endorse what she did, but it understands the situation she was in. So she now has a conviction on her record, but she doesn't have to serve time in prison. If the court believed her story, which is seems it did, then that seems the right decision in the end.

 

[Homicidal_Squirrel]

Allow me to clarify- it is highly unlikely that only defense experts would have examined her and testified. It is almost automatic that the state will hire its own expert as well, unless both sides agree to have a single, mutually chosen diagnostician.

Yes, I understand that. What I mean is that maybe the "professionals" cited in the article were the professionals hired by the defense, and that the ones hired by the prosecution did not have their opinions published in the article. The prosecution's experts may have testified, but their testimony may not have been included in the article, as they may not have agreed with the recommendation. Is that any clearer?

 

[Robin Hoodlum]

But that may cause women to kill partners and then claim abuse in order to get leniency, truth be damned.

I wonder how things would have went if roles were reversed? What if the man was being abused, etc., and killed the woman. Do you think things would have turned out differently for the man?

 

[Zombie_Babies]

Do you have some way to divine her mental state from press releases?

Murder requires a certain state of mind that the prosecution could not convince anyone she had, not even in the indictment phase. That's the part of the pre-trial proceedings in which the prosecution formally charges the defendant with the crimes they will be held over for trial..and of which it has been famously said that you can convince grand juries to indict a ham sandwich for murder.

Thus the term manslaughter or homicide is proper, whereas murder is probably not.

Do you have some way to divine the mental state of the people who charged her? Srsly, dood, you're acting like there's no way they could have just decided to give her a pass even before the trial started. She walked into a sleeping man's room and shot him in the head multiple times. She made up her mind to do it and then did it.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Yes, I understand that. What I mean is that maybe the "professionals" cited in the article were the professionals hired by the defense, and that the ones hired by the prosecution did not have their opinions published in the article. The prosecution's experts may have testified, but their testimony may not have been included in the article, as they may not have agreed with the recommendation. Is that any clearer?

Crystal!

The one thing we know for sure of this aspect of the trial is that whatever experts did testify did not convince a jury that she was an imminent or continuing danger to herself or others.

 

[Homicidal_Squirrel]

Crystal!

The one thing we know for sure of this aspect of the trial is that whatever experts did testify did not convince a jury that she was an imminent or continuing danger to herself or others.

Which is actually one of the criticisms of BWS. The muser of someone by a person claiming BWS/BPS (battered person syndrome as it can apply to men as well) is attributed to some mental ailment that the person has because of all the abuse they have suffered at the hands of their abuser. Yet somehow, after killing their abuser, they are no longer a threat to anyone. It's as if killing the person somehow cured them. Seems odd. It may be accepted in the legal system, but in psychological circles, it appears a washy.

 

[Bedrockgames]

But that may cause women to kill partners and then claim abuse in order to get leniency, truth be damned.

it is possible. I think she was lucky though that she got off in this case, it could easily hat resulted in her going to prison. Still I think in this case she doesnt deserve prison, and wouldn't want to miscarry justice here out of fear that somewhere down the road, someone might kill her husband in cold blood and use abuse as a defense.

I wonder how things would have went if roles were reversed? What if the man was being abused, etc., and killed the woman. Do you think things would have turned out differently for the man?

They probably would have been less sympathetic and i imagine he would have spent time in prison. That doesn't mean the outcome of this case was wrong though, it just means people still have a lot of biases about abuse when men are the victims.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Do you have some way to divine the mental state of the people who charged her? Srsly, dood, you're acting like there's no way they could have just decided to give her a pass even before the trial started. She walked into a sleeping man's room and shot him in the head multiple times. She made up her mind to do it and then did it.

First, let me admit an error- she was actually initially charged with murder in the indictment. Hat means the state prosecutors thought they could prove the necessary mental state for that crime.

However, the prosecution could/did not prove the necessary mental state for murder, and convicted her of the lesser included offense of manslaughter. Here's why:

§202§204
Title 17-A: MAINE CRIMINAL CODE
Part 2: SUBSTANTIVE OFFENSES
Chapter 9: OFFENSES AGAINST THE PERSON
Chapter 9: OFFENSES AGAINST THE PERSON
§203. Manslaughter

1. A person is guilty of manslaughter if that person:
A. Recklessly, or with criminal negligence, causes the death of another human being. Violation of this paragraph is a Class A crime; [2001, c. 383, §156 (AFF); 2001, c. 383, §9 (AMD).]

B. Intentionally or knowingly causes the death of another human being under circumstances that do not constitute murder because the person causes the death while under the influence of extreme anger or extreme fear brought about by adequate provocation. Adequate provocation has the same meaning as in section 201, subsection 4. The fact that the person causes the death while under the influence of extreme anger or extreme fear brought about by adequate provocation constitutes a mitigating circumstance reducing murder to manslaughter and need not be proved in any prosecution initiated under this subsection. Violation of this paragraph is a Class A crime; or [2001, c. 383, §156 (AFF); 2001, c. 383, §9 (AMD).]

So, not "murder", but manslaughter, or the perfectly adequate "homicide" which presupposes nothing more than that a person has killed a human being.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

But that may cause women to kill partners and then claim abuse in order to get leniency, truth be damned.

I wonder how things would have went if roles were reversed? What if the man was being abused, etc., and killed the woman. Do you think things would have turned out differently for the man?

There are a lot of women doing life sentences for killing abusive significant others.

BWS cases usually don't result in acquittals or even reduced sentences...maybe 1% of all such claims are successful.

 

[Robin Hoodlum]

it is possible. I think she was lucky though that she got off in this case, it could easily hat resulted in her going to prison. Still I think in this case she doesnt deserve prison, and wouldn't want to miscarry justice here out of fear that somewhere down the road, someone might kill her husband in cold blood and use abuse as a defense.



They probably would have been less sympathetic and i imagine he would have spent time in prison. That doesn't mean the outcome of this case was wrong though, it just means people still have a lot of biases about abuse when men are the victims.

Agreed.