Epic Feats and ECL

[James McMurray]

Can a character with an ECL of 24, but a class level of 20 choose an epic feat as his 18th class level feat? He would have been ECL 22 at the time.

Thanks.

 

[Magic Rub]

Zaa?

I think your math is a bit funny, you're giving to much info, my brain is over loading.

If a train leaves Winnipeg traveling at 400km's/hour... and a car leaves Paris carrying 200lbs of metric meter sticks... Can my 21st level expert with a strength of 2 take the feat Power Attack if the God of fluffy cushions grants it to him?


Sorry

So... The char. is currently ECL 24 over all, with 20 class levels (fighter I'd assume).

But, for the purposes of this question... The char. is currently ECL 22 over all, with 18 class levels (fighter I'd assume).

I would say No (IMO). But the rules for this (depending on who you ask) are a bit grey. It's like the basic Multi-class issue. Ie; can a 22nd level PC, 18/4 Fighter/Cleric, take his Non-Epic fighter bonus feats as Epic feats? I would say no but others would argue their equally valid points & say yes.

 

[James McMurray]

I would say No (IMO). But the rules for this (depending on who you ask) are a bit grey. It's like the basic Multi-class issue. Ie; can a 22nd level PC, 18/4 Fighter/Cleric, take his Non-Epic fighter bonus feats as Epic feats? I would say no but others would argue their equally valid points & say yes.

This one is clearly laid out in the FAQ as a "no". Unforunately, my question doesn't appear in the FAQ.

 

[Magic Rub]

This one is clearly laid out in the FAQ as a "no". Unforunately, my question doesn't appear in the FAQ.

Cool beans!

Thanks James, I didn't know that the faq's had been updated to include the who Epic PC Multiclass feat thingy.

As for your question, I would still say that no you can't. The Epic multi-class feat question is a good mile stone for this IMO.

 

[Angcuru]

CHARACTER LEVEL is what determines whether or not you can take epic feats. ECL does not come into play. Otherwise you'd see a character playing a Paragon Celestial Half-Dragon Werebear Worm that Walks Lvl 1 Bard who can take Epic Level Feats.

 

[James McMurray]

But is that really a problem? The character listed wold have an ECL of 30-40. Its not like he'd be travelling with other first level characters, or only need 1000xp to hit second level.

 

[drnuncheon]

CHARACTER LEVEL is what determines whether or not you can take epic feats. ECL does not come into play.

Well, unless you use the rules from the Epic Level Handbook.

page 25: "For example, a creature with a level adjustment of +5 who is also a 13th-level fighter/3rd level blackguard is ECL 21 and eligible to select an epic feat provided he meets the requirements."

The class level feat (in the original question) has been hotly debated, and Andy Collins and James Wyatt have given opposing answers to the question.

J

 

[Spatula]

Can a character with an ECL of 24, but a class level of 20 choose an epic feat as his 18th class level feat? He would have been ECL 22 at the time.

If you're talking about a bonus feat gained from a class (like a fighter bonus feat), then it's up in the air. If you're talking about a feat gained for hitting the 18th character level, then yes, this is explicitly spelled out in the ELH.

 

[spunky_mutters]

If you rule that you must have a class level of 21+ to take Epic feats from that class list (as the fighter is restricted to fighter feats, and hasn't 'opened' the epic fighter list yet), then someone who takes the Archmage PrC will have to wait until they hit Wizard 21/Archmage5 to be eligible for wizard epic feats. Kind of sucks to take Archmage if you're going to epic levels. Hierophant suffers from this as well. They really need 10-level variants of these classes if this is the rule.

 

[drnuncheon]

If you rule that you must have a class level of 21+ to take Epic feats from that class list (as the fighter is restricted to fighter feats, and hasn't 'opened' the epic fighter list yet), then someone who takes the Archmage PrC will have to wait until they hit Wizard 21/Archmage5 to be eligible for wizard epic feats.

Yep, that one level 20 feat has to be non-epic. It's a killer.

Hierophants have even less of an issue, since they will be picking up their final 5 levels of clerical spellcasting.

Of course, you could always go Wiz (or Clr)20 and then pick up the appropriate PrC. Having to wait for epic feats is part of the price of getting the Archmage and Hierophant powers earlier. (Heck, some of those powers are probably worth an epic feat. Mastery of Elements, I'm looking at you...)

J