Favorite superhero RPGs?

[Thomas Shey]

Sorry, dude. You've lost me.

Let me use an example where it worked pretty well, even though its a system I fell out of love with.

Mutants and Masterminds, though evolved from D&D3e, is philosophically a relative of Champions; its effect based, point built and class and level (at least in the sense its used in normal level systems) free.

One of the things you do is buy your Accuracy in combat. There are degrees of breadth in how you do it (so you can specialize or not).

So let's say you have a Superman expie and a Batman expie at the same power level. The Superman expie buys his Accuracy at +8 and his Strength (which he'll use for damage when not using his heat vision) at +12. Batmanoid buys his Accuracy at +12, buys his Strength at +6 (which is within the high end human range) and buys an extra +2 damage to represent martial arts.

Both of them buy Power Attack. Power Attack allows you to take a penalty of up to -5 on your attack to add a bonus of up to +5 on your damage.

The difference is, the Superman type is probably only using this to, say, punch out giant robots and other things with no defense worth mentioning. The Batman equivalent, on the other hand, starts with a high enough attack that against a lot of easy-to-hit-but-tough opponents he can afford to throw it all to damage and still have a fair chance of hitting.

In terms of basic damage, he's still well below the Superman equivalent, and hit maximum is well below him. But in terms of practical ability to deliver damage, he's not that bad off.

Since I know you're a Hero guy, you get something not dissimilar with Haymakers, and a number of other supers games have something similar.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

The difference is, the Superman type is probably only using this to, say, punch out giant robots and other things with no defense worth mentioning. The Batman equivalent, on the other hand, starts with a high enough attack that against a lot of easy-to-hit-but-tough opponents he can afford to throw it all to damage and still have a fair chance of hitting.

In terms of basic damage, he's still well below the Superman equivalent, and hit maximum is well below him. But in terms of practical ability to deliver damage, he's not that bad off.

As I recall their HEROic analogs, SuperClones were typically built to deliver lots of damage when they hit, but they might not hit all that often. And their HTH combat was generally untrained. They relied on the basic combat maneuvers (like Haymakers) as compared to true martial arts maneuvers.

BatClones would have a lot of trained martial arts maneuvers to choose from that they could use with great accuracy. On top of that, they’d have a bunch of Combat Skill Levels and even General Skill Levels to further goose accuracy, etc. Basically, a PC like this would be taking down unskilled human combatants at will- virtually untouchable- while skilled combatants would take more time. And even supers could be threatened.

Tangentially, I’m also reminded of how DC wrote their elite martial artists in the 1980s-90s. Batman considered himself pretty much the best martial artist in the world. But other elite martial artists- while recognizing his formidable talent, also saw weaknesses Wayne couldn’t perceive. For instance, during one mission, Paul Kirk (Manhunter) noticed that Batman’s EGO made him challenge skilled combatants over underlings, slowing him down. Meanwhile, Manhunter mowed mooks down to hasten achieving the mission objective. And Manhunter’s assessment was spot on- Manhunter completed the mission in the nick of time while Batman was still bogged down.

 

[DrunkonDuty]

Let me use an example where it worked pretty well, even though its a system I fell out of love with.

Mutants and Masterminds, though evolved from D&D3e, is philosophically a relative of Champions; its effect based, point built and class and level (at least in the sense its used in normal level systems) free.

One of the things you do is buy your Accuracy in combat. There are degrees of breadth in how you do it (so you can specialize or not).

So let's say you have a Superman expie and a Batman expie at the same power level. The Superman expie buys his Accuracy at +8 and his Strength (which he'll use for damage when not using his heat vision) at +12. Batmanoid buys his Accuracy at +12, buys his Strength at +6 (which is within the high end human range) and buys an extra +2 damage to represent martial arts.

Both of them buy Power Attack. Power Attack allows you to take a penalty of up to -5 on your attack to add a bonus of up to +5 on your damage.

The difference is, the Superman type is probably only using this to, say, punch out giant robots and other things with no defense worth mentioning. The Batman equivalent, on the other hand, starts with a high enough attack that against a lot of easy-to-hit-but-tough opponents he can afford to throw it all to damage and still have a fair chance of hitting.

In terms of basic damage, he's still well below the Superman equivalent, and hit maximum is well below him. But in terms of practical ability to deliver damage, he's not that bad off.

Since I know you're a Hero guy, you get something not dissimilar with Haymakers, and a number of other supers games have something similar.

Thanks for the reply. I really should have understood you the first time, but I totally blanked.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Thanks for the reply. I really should have understood you the first time, but I totally blanked.

Its not a problem. I'm all too fond of explaining things I've thought about and know well.

 

[Wendell_Burke]

What makes a good superhero RPG for you? Which ones have you read? Which have you played or run? What do you like about the games, the genre, and the stories? What's your favorite superhero RPG?

Let's see. There's classic TSR Marvel Super Heroes. Marvel SAGA. Marvel Universe. Marvel Heroic RPG. And now Marvel Multiverse RPG. There's DC Heroes. DC Universe. DC Adventures. HERO. Mutants & Masterminds. Capes, Cowls, and Villains Foul. Capes. Capers. Cartoon Action Hour. Champions. City of Mists. Claim the Sky. Brave New World. Above the Earth. BASH. Daring Comics. FIST. Galaxies in Peril. Worlds in Peril. Masks: A New Generation. Golden Heroes. Icons. Superworld. Stuper Powers. Prowlers & Paragons. Rotten Capes. Smallville. Supers. Supercrew. Tiny Supers. Truth & Justice. Underground. Valiant Universe. Venture City Stories. Villains & Vigilantes. Wild Talents. With Great Power.

Then there's all the generic systems that can handle superheroes.

What's your favorite superhero RPG? : TSR’s Marvel Superheroes Advanced Boxed Set, Mayfair’s DC Heroes 3rd Ed., Champions 4th ed.

Which ones have you read? : The above, obviously. Parts of a handful of other superhero games, but I prefer to focus on the games that appeal the most to me.

Which have you played or run? :I played in TSR’s Marvel Superheroes Advanced for years, and I’ve also run that game for others. I did character creation for Champions and DC Heroes but never got to play them.

What do you like about the games? :I have a strong appreciation for the older design philosophies of these rpgs.

TSR’s Marvel Superheroes Advanced Set: I love the karma reward system. IMO, it’s the best reward system I’ve encountered in an rpg. I really liked the writing style and the flavor text. The Power Stunt system is a favorite. I love the I.P. and I like the level of complexity, or in this case, simplicity. The named categories make character creation and playing more fun for me.

Mayfair’s DC Heroes 3rd Ed.: I love the I.P. and I like the level of complexity. It was a little confusing at first, but I love how much the game encompasses, how well and how simply it does it.

Champions 4th ed.: I LOVE how precise, how nuanced you can get with character creation! The system has pretty much thought of everything and everything seems to work well within the rules. As much as I like playing in established I.P.’s, with the right GM, I can enjoy playing in unestablished or unfamiliar I.P.’s like Champions.

What do you like about the genre and stories? : I love the Idealism and brightness of the superhero genre, particularly from the mid 80’s-mid 90’s. The genre was losing some of its innocence while just starting to get a little cynical. I love the general directness of the stories, and the increasing skill and sensitivity of writing drama at that time. I loved that the players were encouraged to work together to make a positive impact on the world.

What makes a good superhero RPG for you? There’s more, but it’s difficult to express off the cuff. To start? Everything positive I’ve mentioned above.

 

[teitan]

I am an outlier, in order Mutants & Mastermind First Edition with Annual 1, DC Heroes/MEGS, FASERIP/616 tied.

M&M1e I think hit that perfect space between powers based and effects based character creation. With just a few minor fixes it was perfect like skill points and adding a small handful of powers to the mix. It was light, breezy and the sample characters were unique and flavorful without going grim n' gritty.

DC Heroes: power based characters, scaling, DC license. SO well thought out.

FASERIP and 616 tie. They hit the same vibe to me and the same level of difficulty in running/chargen with 616 edging out FASERIP for not having a chart and random creation. FASERIP ties with it because it captures old Marvel flavor so well though and 616 isn't quite there on that old school Marvel feel.