[FFD20] Let's Mass our Forces, and Rebuild our Power

[drothgery]

Dark Knight and Paladin should be prestige classes. The Paladin especially. Cecil had to do a whole lot more than level to become one.

That template idea sounds interesting, but could be difficult to set up in an easily understandible manner.

I would be more than happy to help with races and feats. A few Prestige Classes have popped up in my mind as well.

Actually, I'd make Dragoon and Paladin PrCs, but I'd probably just kill off Dark Knight as a distinct class. There didn't seem to be any Dark Knight special abilities in FFIV that wouldn't fit with a standard knight; the only thing Cecil lost was the ability to use some weapons, but that's explainable by an alignment change.

 

[Ako Mainyu]

Actually, when FFIV came stateside as FFII, we were dicked; Cecil had a Dark Knight ability, I believe it was called Dark Wave (I can't remember). It was a nice ability that did a good load of damage to all the enemies on the screen, but took up HP to use. It was never featured in FFIIa.

Another question is this: every Final Fantasy has a unique Magic system. For example, in FF1 the magic system is almost identical to the Sorcerer in 3ed. In FF6, you learned magic from Espers, and in FF7 you equipped Materia to learn spells, and when you unequipped them, you lost those spells. The question is, how or which magic system would we use, or could we find a way to use any of them. Maybe make rules for them and have the dungeon master choose the magic system. Further more, for example, we could have a Prc called the "Materia Knight", and another called the "Mako Sorcerer".

Hence my question, are we emulating a Final Fantasy or creating a core system based on Final Fantasies? It would seem that the magic system would either have to be highly modular OR that the concepts like Materia would have to be altered (i.e. a Fire materia would grant the caster +x bonus on casting Fire-element magic).

 

[drothgery]

I'd hold off on trying do anything with Espers or Materia or FFVIII-style draw magic for a while.

 

[Drake Masters]

Magic and Races

Then perhaps the next question would be if Espers should be a playable race, or should they be treated as monsters? And if they are a playable race, how would we handle their racial Magical abilities, since it vareis by esper.

 

[Drake Masters]

Lost Class

Archer
Bard
Berserker
Black Wizard
Blue Wizard
Calculator
Caller
Chemist
Dancer
Dark Knight
Dragoon
Engineer
Geomancer
Knight
Mediator
Mimic
Monk
Mystic Knight
Ninja
Oracle
Paladin
Red Wizard
Samurai
Summoner
Thief
Time Wizard
White Wizard
Roughly 10 more Unique classes from Final Fantasy Tactics...
And a Few classes that can be derived from Final Fantasy VI...

There's one class I cant find in here, the sorcerer from FF5. Combat wise, that was one of the coolest classess. I am suggesting this as a PrC. What do ya think?

 

[Creamsteak]

I volunteer to help with feats. In your previous version, you had most of the classes having Bonus Feats. I would be happy to volunteer for feat placement and creation. Second, what kind of spell list are we gonna use, I mean are we gonna make our own up, or are we just gonna adapt from the DnD books?

My concept remains the same as it was before, MP is cumulative between classes and each individual character must select spells in a method similar to a Sorcerer. Some DnD spells will be taken (there was this one website that put together an intersting Time Mage/Black Mage/White Mage spell list... that's a decent starting point). Other spells will be hand tailored. I'm against numbers though, fire 1 and such... I say we steal the names from the Final Fantasy 8 spells.

 

[Creamsteak]

It's a deeper question than I asked it as, excuse me =P Well, it's obvious that if it were to emulate any previous FF, it would be definitely 1-6 (and Tactics). And I realise the classes aren't final, and a lot of them are prestige versions of previous classes. However, my question was going to this (I should be more to the point, aye?): will you be including any classes, concepts rather, that weren't featured in any previous FF but are fitting enough for the FF-world (Chocovier, &c. &c.) I think classes will be a hot point for discussion. Anyways...

Alright, well... not planning on it... but we could always add it later. Right now we want to work on the core material, then we move on and around the mechanics.

And for class advancement, could be done either by tiers. Though in two seperate areas. You can either go from Fighter to Knight, and then from Knight to Paladin, or to Dark Knight, or to even Dragoon. But progression is always in 1 dimension; you can never go back and be something else (linear progression). Which really limits the character and forces them to make decisions on whether advancement is worth it. Or you can go from Fighter to Knight, hop back and go to Mage, the onto Mystic Knight (multiclassing), which is defaultingly standard. The latter's dealt with easily in d20, but the former?

I'm in agreement with the DmG that we don't need to arbitrarily decide what classes can advance where. I say we just set requirements that make it easier to advance along the obvious path...

 

[Creamsteak]

Re: Magic and Races

Then perhaps the next question would be if Espers should be a playable race, or should they be treated as monsters? And if they are a playable race, how would we handle their racial Magical abilities, since it vareis by esper.

We are not concerned with Espers, Materia, or anything even remotely similar to that yet. All of that is for supplementary work. The core material is all that matters at the moment. Classes, player character races, certain kinds of equipment, feats, skills, and other similar mechanics. Anything that complicates the game needs to be delayed till later. Right now I want something so simple that it can be plugged into a traditional Dungeons and Dragons game with no worries.

 

[Creamsteak]

Actually, I'd make Dragoon and Paladin PrCs, but I'd probably just kill off Dark Knight as a distinct class. There didn't seem to be any Dark Knight special abilities in FFIV that wouldn't fit with a standard knight; the only thing Cecil lost was the ability to use some weapons, but that's explainable by an alignment change.

Check out Final Fantasy Anthologies. They returned the Dark Knights true ability, and who is to say there will not be more?

Personally I'm between on the Paladin. Leaving it core would allow players to play one from 1st level. That's a pretty important thing to remember, starting at 1st level in a class can mean a lot. If we do it as a prestige class, it's going to need more 'ad-hock' design as well, as there would be a lot more mechanics involved.

I could go either way though...

 

[Creamsteak]

Let me try this...

I'm going to arbitrate a single class that we will work on first. Let's just focus on that one point for a short while, then move on. Let's start with the basic six:

Fighter (Fighter FF1, Knight FFT, Knight FF5)
Thief (Thief FF1, Thief FFT, Thief FF5, Locke FF6)
Black Belt (Black Belt FF1, Monk FFT, Yang FF4, Sabin FF6)
Red Mage (Red Mage FF1, Red Mage FF5)
White Mage (White Mage FF1, Polom FF4, Rosa FF4, Priest FFT, White Mage FF5)
Black Mage (Black Mage FF1, Porom FF4, Wizard FFT, Black Mage FF5)

We will leave their names as they are for right now. Don't consider anything outside of the scope of 'what made these characters what they are'. We will make a list of the abilities, traits, and skills that we percieved from these six classes.

Fighter: Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Proficient in all simple and martial weapons, all armor, and all shields. Skills: 2 + Int modifier, Climb, Craft, Intimidate, Jump, Ride... and a few others... Class Abilities: Bonus feats, broad selection including sunder feats, combat actions...

The way I'm seeing this class develop, it's about as close to the DnD fighter as it can be. It might make sense to just leave this class as it is from that form, but expand on the feats list with a number of FF specific feats...