Fighting from horseback

[The_Universe]

It's pretty straight-forward, it's just a matter of getting it all straight and remembering to apply it appropriately in combat.

One question, though. Using the GT Chase rules, what is the standard move per round? Is it generally considered to be a double move to maintain the pace? Or is it simply one move action (60 feet)? And how does that interact with some of the movement limitations on mounted combat actions?

Hopefully that makes sense.

I'm actually going to try to transfer the grim tales stuff into an electronic format so we can look at it and see how it fits together with the above.

Essentially, most of the changes will merely represent a number of extended options in the "Combat While Mounted" section of Mounted Combat.

As to the specific speed question, "vehicle" speed is reduced to a "speed advantage" since the *actual* speed at which you're travelling (other than 1x move, 2x move, 3-4x move, etc.) doesn't matter. FPS/MPH don't really matter in absolute terms - it just matters how much faster you are than the other guy(s).

 

[AIM-54]

As to the specific speed question, "vehicle" speed is reduced to a "speed advantage" since the *actual* speed at which you're travelling (other than 1x move, 2x move, 3-4x move, etc.) doesn't matter. FPS/MPH don't really matter in absolute terms - it just matters how much faster you are than the other guy(s).

My question was not about FPS/MPH or anything. It was about how does 1x move, 2x move, 3-4x move interact with the chase rule dynamic. I may just lack a full understanding of the chase rule right now (it was just a Ride check, IIRC from the first session to catch up/fall behind on a fail). But for it to be a chase, is there a base speed which everyone is assumed to be moving (thus voiding the necessity of moving minis on a map, save where chase maneuvers [falling back, speeding up etc] are successfully attempted), thus dictating what actions are available, presuming some move actions are required to be in the chase in the first place (but maybe that's assumed out?).

Thus, if the basic movement mechanic is assumed away (or how that's assumed away) will effect how those actions operate. If it's just assumed that typically a horse is running under those circumstances (double-move) then it affects what options a player has in combat or creates the need for new understanding of what can be done based on the chase rules and throwing out the standard move/double-move/full-move understanding of combat.

I'm sure this will all become much clearer once we reconcile the chase rule mechanic with the mounted combat mechanics. I'm just trying to think through some of the issues here.

Also, it's kinda jumbled because there's a bunch of things running around in my head. Possibly at 3-4x movement.

 

[The_Universe]

My question was not about FPS/MPH or anything. It was about how does 1x move, 2x move, 3-4x move interact with the chase rule dynamic. I may just lack a full understanding of the chase rule right now (it was just a Ride check, IIRC from the first session to catch up/fall behind on a fail). But for it to be a chase, is there a base speed which everyone is assumed to be moving (thus voiding the necessity of moving minis on a map, save where chase maneuvers [falling back, speeding up etc] are successfully attempted), thus dictating what actions are available, presuming some move actions are required to be in the chase in the first place (but maybe that's assumed out?).

In my spare moments, I'm working at compiling a document that will include all of the stuff you can do with a ride check, and its basic implications. Unfortunately for me, that includes transcribing and editing the majority of the Grim Tales chase chapter and squishing it together with the stuff that you have (wonderfully!) posted above. But that's just generally what's happening.

As to your specific question, the chase rules "kick in" as soon as the chase moves beyond walking speed. So, if your horse is only moving its "standard" 60 ft/round (or whatever that number happens to be) the chase rules don't matter. At that point, we're still at a scale where we can move our little guys around the mat at an "absolute scale" rather than the "relative" scale of the chase rules.

Thus, if the basic movement mechanic is assumed away (or how that's assumed away) will effect how those actions operate. If it's just assumed that typically a horse is running under those circumstances (double-move) then it affects what options a player has in combat or creates the need for new understanding of what can be done based on the chase rules and throwing out the standard move/double-move/full-move understanding of combat.

I think (as I read through my photocopy of the chapter) the understanding of the chase rules is that even though your horse is moving more quickly at a double move, you're still only making one ride check to guide your mount...unless you decide to undertake multiple maneuvers. As I understand it, a "maneuver" is the equivalent of a move action - which means that, assuming nothing else happens, you can make two maneuvers in a round without penalty. If (for example) you wanted to make a maneuver *and* fire a weapon, you'd only be able to actively declare 1 maneuver and 1 attack. Any further necessary ride checks (such as reacting to terrain obstacles or to the maneuvers of others) incur a penalty based on how maneuverable your mount is. For horses, that's generally a -1/extra ride check.

I'm sure this will all become much clearer once we reconcile the chase rule mechanic with the mounted combat mechanics. I'm just trying to think through some of the issues here.

That's what I'm working on. I *sense* that all of these things can't work relatively elegently together, but getting all of the information in one place is a necessary first step, I think.

Also, it's kinda jumbled because there's a bunch of things running around in my head. Possibly at 3-4x movement.

I wish I wasn't the only one with Grim Tales - another set of eyes on this would probably be helpful.

 

[cuteasaurus]

Ack! I'm...overwhelmed...

 

[The_Universe]

It's a lot to take in - and there's more yet!

That's why we're trying to compile the options and make it clearer what's available when.

 

[The_Universe]

I just want to say that there are an ungodly number of chase maneuvers in the grim tales book. And that's just maneuvers - that's not even including the basic rules. Ugh.

But, making progress!

 

[The_Universe]

You thought you were overwhelmed before

Attached is a PDF file that combines the normal mounted combat rules with the "chase rules" found in Grim Tales. I've changed a few things here and there and done some extensive reorganization of infromation, but the most important thing to remember is:

1) These rules apply only during a chase/high speed battle. You don't need to worry about them when everything is still happening at a "normal" tactical scale.

2) We need to agree on this particular implementation (or something like it) before they become "official" house rules. I hope I've made things a little easier to understand - please feel free to post your own questions and ideas.

 

[The_Universe]

Is anybody even interested in this?

 

[cuteasaurus]

Honestly...I'm too overwhelmed with these rules to even know what to say. And am I correct in saying that these discussions don't pertain to "normal" chases with guns? Only when we're going uber-fast?

 

[The_Universe]

These rules are for times when the speed or scale of the chase are such that representing things at a normal scale would be difficult. Horseback and similar "chases" are certainly the most frequent examples we've had thus far, though I suppose there could be other situations in which it would be easier to use these than the regular rules.

The above effort was made so that the rules for chases/mounted combat would be transparent and available to you, rather than me having to rule independently on every potential situation.