D&D 4E Find the Anime/Video games in 4e

[Rechan]

I may be wrong, but I believe he is referring to the 3.5 xph. There were mmo's by then.

My copy of the 3.5 XPH says it was published in April 2004.

WoW didn't come out until November, 2004.

Now, I know that Everquest and perhaps Dark Age of Camelot may have existed before these points, but I'm not sure if either of those games had the "Re-tool" thingie.

 

[Scribble]

Except that I would argue that D&D has never been a very good Generic Medieval Europe Fantasy Roleplaying Game. It's just been D&D.

And just because there is stuff in there that doesn't Fit in European Fantasy 101 doesn't mean that it can't support Generic European Fantasy Roleplaying Game.

Case in point being the Barbarian. Is there any instance in Europe of guys leaping on other people's backs and biting them, or clawing at their face? Does that sound like the Goths? As I said earlier, the Barbarian is more feral, and emulates animals (I'm guessing that the Barbarian will have Totems, like the UA barbarians). So it makes sense that they would have attacks named after animals.

How about the Druid, hippies who shapechanged into bears and lions? Not very European fantasy there. The Celts' didn't exactly have a lot of "And then he became an alligator and ate the enemy's face" legends.

So, I'm pretty sure you can have European Fantasy 101 and not have too much of a broken vermisilitude if you remove the Druid and Barbarian.

Also... it might just be me... But I'm pretty sure medieval europe never had brain eating squid monsters, acidic jelly cubes, dinosaurs, and a whole host of other weird monsters and effects you find in D&D...

 

[Conjurer]

Capa Ferro sounds Italian to me. Probably Iron Cape (though neither Inigo nor MiB are wearing capes in that scene)

 

[kennew142]

I'm a huge, huge proponent of having named fighting styles in D&D. I'm very much opposed to any name that would sound better coming from a pajama-clad open-handed fighter than from an armored knight or rapier-wielding swashbuckler.

My D&D has absolutely no room for characters who adventure in pajamas.

It's probably a good thing for the hobby that the designers are in no way as limited in their concept of the genre as you appear to be. The second sentence above may be the single most intolerant and narrow minded statement I've read on this forum.

For the record, I'm a classicist/historian. Most of the games I've run have been quasi-historical games based on western tropes. The sheer inanity of the above comments are embarrassing. No smiley. I'm not joking.

 

[bonethug0108]

My copy of the 3.5 XPH says it was published in April 2004.

WoW didn't come out until November, 2004.

Now, I know that Everquest and perhaps Dark Age of Camelot may have existed before these points, but I'm not sure if either of those games had the "Re-tool" thingie.

Then perhaps it is a d&d thing. But then again, this isn't just about mmo's. Anyone know of any video game that had a character respec type thing before 2004?

 

[Henry]

The biggest problem I have with threads of this nature is that they tend to follow a pattern.

1. Poster #1 asks, "where are the video game / anime examples?"

2. Poster #2 supplies points A, B, C, and D.

3. Poster #1, or more likely Poster #3, then proceeds to dissect each individual point, saying that A can be found in this genre also, B in a different genre, C can be found in previous editions of the game, and D can be found in many other RPGs of earlier days. Then they conclude that Poster #1's point isn't valid.

4. Poster #2 gets frustrated, because he feels like he wasn't being listened to at all.

It's like person #1 saying, "prove that Mr. Jones is a computer technician."
Person #2 says, "Mr. Jones works for DataCorp, his job title is 'I.T. Staff,' and he spends all day fixing PCs."
Person #1 says, "Well, Mrs. Smith works for DataCorp, too, but she's not in I.T. Furthermore, IT Staff is a broad job title, and covers not just computer technicians, but Network Administrators, some coders, and even the head of the department who hasn't touched a screwdriver in years. And lastly, I just spent all day last week rebuilding my tower to get it up to snuff to play my newest computer game, but I'm not a computer technician. Therefore, your facts don't really seem to hold water."
Person #2 says, "ARRRGH!" because he feels like person #1 is being deliberately obtuse (which in my little fictional example person 1 would be.)

So a lot of times, the examples that are given need to be also evaluated in their context, rather than dissected. If someone gives lots of examples that all apply to one thing, but could also apply to a bunch of different things too, it doesn't mean they're valueless. They might be circumstantial, but a large amount of circumstantial examples about the same thing should be reason for at least pause and consideration before dismissal.

 

[PeterWeller]

Then perhaps it is a d&d thing. But then again, this isn't just about mmo's. Anyone know of any video game that had a character respec type thing before 2004?

Star Wars Galaxies. City of Heroes might have.

 

[bonethug0108]

Star Wars Galaxies. City of Heroes might have.

COH actually came out in April 2004, so I doubt it could have affected the book. But seeing wotc close tie to star wars, that could be an explaination.

To Henry:
That problem with what you are saying though, Henry, is that many people fail to realise that d&d actually influenced these video games that people are so afraid d&d is becoming. They complain that this is too video gamey and that is too mmo when really those games took those elements from d&d.

Then without realizing their oversight, they go on to tout the downfall of d&d because it is become a game for these "younger" video game and mmo players, when in truth that is far from fact. Not only that, but it is actually people over the age of 20 that makes up a LARGE base of video game and mmo players.

So if people want to try to bad mouth something on false facts, I'm going to correct it.

 

[ArmoredSaint]

Capa Ferro sounds Italian to me. Probably Iron Cape

Capo Ferro="Iron Head," I think.

Except that I would argue that D&D has never been a very good Generic Medieval Europe Fantasy Roleplaying Game. It's just been D&D.

Good at emulating medieval Europe or not, staying true to D&D's medieval-esque fantasy roots is one of the stated design goals of 4th Edition, per the "Races & Classes" preview. To me, that sounds like Asian-style monks, etc. will take a back seat to armoured knights and other standard Euro-style fantasy tropes. IMO, this is as it should be; I freely admit my personal bias in favor of medieval European-flavored D&D. I don' think it's unfair to ask the fans of monks, samurai, shugenja, etc. to wait for the inevitable "Oriental Adventures" book.

On topic now, I don't really see much anime/manga influence in what we've seen of 4th Edition D&D so far. As someone else pointed out in another thread, much of what gets categorized as anime-flavored actually has its roots in older action movie traditions.

 

[Henry]

To Henry:
That problem with what you are saying though, Henry, is that many people fail to realise that d&d actually influenced these video games that people are so afraid d&d is becoming. They complain that this is too video gamey and that is too mmo when really those games took those elements from d&d.

Then without realizing their oversight, they go on to tout the downfall of d&d because it is become a game for these "younger" video game and mmo players, when in truth that is far from fact. Not only that, but it is actually people over the age of 20 that makes up a LARGE base of video game and mmo players.

However, if they were influenced by D&D, why do they look so different (in the case of per encounter versus per day) when they are "imported" back into D&D? They've been filtered through their own experience and usage in the games they were used in, and that mechanic, interpreted for use in a tabletop RPG, can be VERY different in practice from the previous edition.

If when 4E comes out it does do to D&D what Saga did for Star Wars, then it will mean that 4E won't support several styles of play that were present in previous editions, and for better or worse it will mean that some gamers will not be using it. For Star Wars, I think Saga had some good changes, because of the feel of the films, but the feel of the prequels is VERY different from the feel of the first three films, and both are not the feel of play of earlier editions of D&D. (Admittedly, this argument has been around ever since 3E debuted, it's just more pronounced for 4E, when they announced several of the changes.)