From Bespoke to Universal: Let's Talk About TTRPG Systems and Themes

[Thomas Shey]

What do you want from your TTRPG?

HERO'S rules are about accurately representing superpowers, modeling superheroes, and combining them in whatever fashion you want.

Monsterhearts' rules are about conflicts derived from relationships, personal ethos, and High School drama.

Now that I think about it, combining these rules sets would be feasible...

Which was my point. You could make an argument it could go other way, but I'm willing to bet I could get a hybrid that combined the two starting from Hero and make it work a lot faster than the other way around.

(Note: this may not be true for those who don't require strong engagement with the combat element, but I'm assuming that is, in fact, part of what one wants or you could probably just hybridize Monsterhearts and Masks).

 

[Wolfpack48]

No, I disagree as a general statement. Hero is all about powers and fights. It's an elaborate tactical system that focuses on the tactical effects of powers, primarily adjudicates battles and related kinds of stuff. It's systems and processes of play, how it allocates authority, etc. is all entirely at odds with the premise of Monsterhearts. It isn't even that it won't HELP you with this sort of play, it's going to actually undermine it. In a million play sessions you will never get Monsterhearts out of Hero/Champions, not once.

So you’re saying it’s impossible to repurpose and/or extend Hero’s existing “tactical effects of powers and adjudicating battles” to tactical effects of teen romancing powers and adjudicating angst and teenage social tensions?

 

[Ruin Explorer]

So you’re saying it’s impossible to repurpose and/or extend Hero’s existing “tactical effects of powers and adjudicating battles” to tactical effects of teen romancing powers and adjudicating angst and teenage social tensions?

I mean, no-one has done it that I'm aware of, and I don't immediately see how you'd do it in a way which wasn't incredibly contrived and painful overcrunch for what's happening. But maybe someone should try!

 

[DrunkonDuty]

I mean, no-one has done it that I'm aware of, and I don't immediately see how you'd do it in a way which wasn't incredibly contrived and painful overcrunch for what's happening. But maybe someone should try!

A while back I had a conversation here on the forums in which I noodled through some thoughts about using "soap points" as a meta currency for Hero System. After a bit noodling I realised I'd just re-invented fate points and dropped it.

But I later thought, that's not actually a bad thing. Fate points work pretty well. I just needed to come up with a way to mesh the soap points with the existing disads system. I now have a rough draft of something that does just that.

 

[Wolfpack48]

I mean, no-one has done it that I'm aware of, and I don't immediately see how you'd do it in a way which wasn't incredibly contrived and painful overcrunch for what's happening. But maybe someone should try!

Her Wily Charm is attacking his Willful Shyness with a +20% bonus for Romantic Lighting. It would totally work and be a blast!

 

[Reynard]

You all know that Hero has a built in mechanism for "social combat" right? It's inherent in the genre.

 

[Thomas Shey]

I mean, no-one has done it that I'm aware of, and I don't immediately see how you'd do it in a way which wasn't incredibly contrived and painful overcrunch for what's happening. But maybe someone should try!

I have to note one person's "painful overcrunch" is someone else's "desirable detail".

Its not like if someone did it for personal purposes that there'd necessarily be any footprint visible. After all, there aren't that many Monsterhearts-like games of any stripe outside it, so the market may not exactly be huge, or at least perceived as such, and some people may be taking the middle road and using other urban fantasy games for the purpose with or without modifications.

 

[Thomas Shey]

You all know that Hero has a built in mechanism for "social combat" right? It's inherent in the genre.

As-is Presence is a bit brute force for this purpose, being intended more for more "hard" uses, but yes, I'm pretty sure you could adapt it with some work.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

Sure you will. You seem to think somehow its impossible to add additional mechanics or repurpose extent mechanics to support that--even though the Hero System has done so numerous times over the years for special purposes.

It isn't simple a matter of adding on extra mechanics. The structure of play, who says what, under what circumstances, and where the direction of play comes from, is different and serves a different agenda. Beyond that, there are plenty of mechanics in Hero which would be not only surplus to purpose, but actively detract from the focus on the elements of play that are important for Monsterhearts' theme and agenda.

I mean, yes, if you heavily rewrite Hero System you can, perhaps, make an ersatz version of Monsterhearts. Heck, if you are a really good game designer, maybe you can even improve on it! But I think at this point we're not talking about one game can do what another can do, we're just talking about how people can, yes indeed, design new games.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

What do you want from your TTRPG?

HERO'S rules are about accurately representing superpowers, modeling superheroes, and combining them in whatever fashion you want.

Monsterhearts' rules are about conflicts derived from relationships, personal ethos, and High School drama.

Now that I think about it, combining these rules sets would be feasible...

I would never say 'impossible', but you ARE left with 2 issues:

1) Process of play - Hero System is a pretty classic trad RPG. The GM makes up an adventure and the PCs experience it, with possible plot variations, side play, etc. along the way, perhaps. Scenes are mostly pre-plotted, or at least originate in some sort of 'keyed' manner. You can obviously play in a more Narrativist fashion, perhaps, but then the Hero parts of the system are going to need a lot of work.

2) Focus - How do you weave together teen angst and detailed supers combat? I'm not saying its impossible, nor maybe even hard to do, but the resulting game is going to have a pretty divided focus. There may be ways around that, but I think those ways are going to undermine one of the two agendas.