Heroics vs. Keen Edge

[WalrusThief]

Heroics: 2nd Level Spell. Grants 1 fighter bonus feat for 10 minutes/level. For example, Improved Critical (weapon of choice).

Keen Edge: 3rd Level Spell. Makes one slashing weapon keen for 10 minutes/level.

Any reason why Keen Edge is better?

 

[Uder]

Heroics: 2nd Level Spell. Grants 1 fighter bonus feat for 10 minutes/level. For example, Improved Critical (weapon of choice).

Keen Edge: 3rd Level Spell. Makes one slashing weapon keen for 10 minutes/level.

Any reason why Keen Edge is better?

With Heroics, the subject needs to meet the prerequisites of the feat. Other than that, Heroics is better.

 

[WalrusThief]

Yeah, the BAB +8 requirement is a little steep at earlier levels, but overall its a much more versatile spell and can get the same job done (arguably better, if the person is dual-wielding).

 

[Runestar]

Keen edge is core, heroics is SPC.

 

[WalrusThief]

Keen edge is core, heroics is SPC.

True, but they are both 3.5 and WotC.

 

[HoboGod]

The spell isn't so amazing if you're strict about the material component. A bit of weapon or armor used in combat by a 15th+ level fighter. A 15th level fighter tends to be using at least a +4 weapon and at least a +5 armor. There's no way a 3rd level wizard can get her hands on something like that and there's no way eschew materials can produce something like that. Now, if this were a 12th level wizard, I'd see it more likely to be in the wizard's spell component pouch, she'd totally be traveling on the same battlefields as 15th level fighters where a chip of armor fell from a full plate.

So in the end, what is this spell? A great buff spell for later levels than a wizard first gets it, but it's pretty much a free cast by that point.

 

[Runestar]

The spell isn't so amazing if you're strict about the material component. A bit of weapon or armor used in combat by a 15th+ level fighter.

Then why do raksasha and ogre mage parts come free? They may not be worth much, but acquiring them would be a hassle, necessitating some sort of investment.

It has no cost, and so a spell component pouch should provide it just fine.

 

[HoboGod]

Then why do raksasha and ogre mage parts come free? They may not be worth much, but acquiring them would be a hassle, necessitating some sort of investment.

The spell component pouch holds the crap that is the result of a wizard's mundane gleaning during her travels. When you're an 11th level wizard casting contingency, it's not unreasonable that you'd be wandering in places where the remains of a CR 8 Ogre Mage might just happen to be. But a 3th level wizard wandering somewhere that a level 15 fighter would possibly chip a piece of metal off his blade in battle? I'm just not buying it.

It has no cost, and so a spell component pouch should provide it just fine.

By RAW, of course. If the wizard can cast it, it doesn't cost anything, and its components fit in a pouch, the spell component pouch has an unlimited supply of it, I can't argue there. However, I need not illustrate how silly a spell component pouch becomes when interpreted by RAW.

 

[WalrusThief]

Also true. I guess it really depends on the DM. If they are strict about spell components, then its value decreases. If they are more lenient, then it is far superior.

 

[DumbPaladin]

The spell isn't so amazing if you're strict about the material component. A bit of weapon or armor used in combat by a 15th+ level fighter.

I've seen this discussion before, and it tends to come down to the vagueness of what a "bit" of weapon or armor is. To some people, you can get tens of thousands of such bits out of any weapon or suit of armor so utilized. Others have pointed out that the wizard at Ye Olde Magick Shoppe really could simply ask his friend Bob the Level 15 fighter to use 20 different weapons in combat against summoned creatures, and then make many, many bits for use for this spell...