Infinite damage at level 1

[Kurtomatic]

Seriously, what's with the butt-hurt attitude towards the OP? No one is seriously suggesting a DM should or would allow infinitely damage in an actual game. However, while the DM can both implicitly and explicitly nip this in the bud with RAW, the infinite damage scenario does exist within the domain of valid outcomes, rules as written. Which is interesting and worthy of discussion, IMO.

In fact, I think its hilarious. From a software dev point of view this is a classic race condition, and just the sort of thing to escape unit testing, LOL! Wasn't Mike a software engineer before he worked for WotC, and did he review this code, er.., design?

The opportunity action solution is strong; rather than nerf the power, it focuses its design just that much more while eliminating even theoretical RAW abuse. Props guys!

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

My favorite would be teleporting brown mold to the Elemental Plane of Fire

Ah yes... I think the specific version that I once used was a shambling mound and the demi-plane of lightning

 

[sigfile]

You missed a more broken way to work with this. The larger the original creature, the larger (and higher!) the zone. Take a gargantuan critter (4 squares wide/high). Free - teleport up 3. It's still in the zone. Free - teleport up another three. Drop six squares.

Once it's dead, you have a 4x4x4 black hole of insta-death to any adjacent enemies on the battlefield.

 

[unan oranis]

Sure, but by that kind of logic there are NEVER EVER any infinite damage combos.

No, by that kind of logic there are never any infinite damage combos that rely on infinite free actions RAW in order to work.

Nobody is suggesting its anything beyond amusing. Of course the DM is going to squash it in no time flat and that would be both true and allowable simply by rule 0.

I think the whole idea is to force rule 0 into effect; a fun and long standing mini game of trying to find a chink in the armor of an extremely complicated game where you are kind of allowed to do anything.

The original combo suggested in this thread does not succeed in scoring a rule zero.

The fact that there are not infinite free actions is very much addressed, as a specific rule... which if they were numbered would be something like rule 2074, not rule 0.

 

[Lalithor]

Not infinite Damage

Here's my argument. I argue that regardless of how instantaneous and effortless free actions are, it is not infinite damage. Teleportation is instantaneous (PHB p.286) but falling is not instantaneous.

First, we estimate gravity. We have two choices.
1) Use Earth's gravity = Approx. 9.8 m/s^2
2) Estimate DND gravity = Aerial combat rules say that falling from high altitude can last multiple rounds, with a rule of thumb of 100 squares after checking for safe distance (a function of the flying creature's speed) (DMG1 p.48). Assuming worst case scenario (i.e. the 100 squares is solely due to free falling with an initial downward velocity of 0 m/s), falling 500 feet in a 6 second round equates to an acceleration of 8.4 m/s^2 due to gravity (ignoring air resistance).

Next, we calculate the time it would take to fall after being teleported vertically 15 feet.

1) Using Earth's Gravity = 0.95 seconds.
2) Using DND gravity = 1.03 seconds

So, given the rule-of-thumb 1 round = 6 seconds, you could teleport a creature 6 times per round, assuming no limits on free actions.

Now, the actual number would be closer to 1 or 2 times per round. Consider the following:
1) A very good reaction time is about a tenth of a second,
2) You cannot simply teleport the creature the instant his big toe touches the ground. The creature must "fully crash" into the ground in order absorb all that kinetic energy into his body and cause damage.
3) The gesture which triggers the teleportation is likely not instantaneous. (e.g., it takes a second to wave your hand, waggle your fingers, shout a trigger word, etc.)

Taking the above 3 points into account, the act of teleporting a single creature, and waiting for it to crash to the ground takes approx. 3 or more seconds, resulting in at most 2 teleportations per round in my DM-ing opinion.

Either way. Not infinite damage.

 

[Destil]

My favorite would be teleporting brown mold to the Elemental Plane of Fire

Shapechange into a 20x20x20 foot adamant cube 200 feet over your foes in 3E.

 

[DracoSuave]

Wait a minute...


This hasn't even been PRINTED yet.

You are aware that previews are subject to change before printing right?


I mean, good eye in catching it, but this is either gonna change when paper is printed, or as a zero hour errata.

 

[fuzzlewump]

Is it accepted that you can even teleport things vertically? This power as it stands seems to assume that you can't, or else I'm fairly sure it would have been worded differently.

Either way, it still causes wacky effects as far as casting it on a creature adjacent to a cliff and forcing the creature down.

 

[unan oranis]

Here's my argument. <snip> Not infinite damage.

Your first post eh?

lol, right on... it's funny what gets people off the bench.

 

[On Puget Sound]

Imagine a party, on the verge of TPK, starting a filibuster in order to forestall their inevitable defeat.

I think I have seen such a party. On CSpan.