Necromancer or DCCs?

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Although both claim to have a first edition vibe to them, I find the products to be fairly different. Of the two, I think DCCs more accurately recreate a 1E module in the 21st century, but I also think that may not be the good thing it seems to be for everyone, as they're much less fleshed out, for the most part, compared to Necromancer stuff.

But having said that, Necromancer is a lot less plug-and-play than DCCs, which can fit into any world at any time at the drop of a hat. (I'm currently repurposing The Dragonfiend Pact for my Ptolus campaign, and it fits in so well, it's sort of spooky.)

Both are very solid and it's hard to find stinkers in either line, just be aware that they're not interchangeable.

 

[Treebore]

I'm not sure I understand your "not interchangeable" statement Whizbang.

If you are "planning" your campaign ahead of time rather than running one and deciding you need a new module, they all are interchangeable. Even if your running an ongoing campaign they all can be fit in. Just realize that Rappan Athuk and Tomb of Abysthor will make up most of such a campaign. Lost City of Barakus will also last 5 to 8 levels of play.

So the fact that many of Necromancers module will take you through 3 to 10 levels rather than one or two would make them less plug and play, or interchangeable. So yes, you do have to account for how many levels the PC's would earn going through many of Necromancers modules in comparison to the DCC's and decide if you want it to eat up that much of your campaign.

As for Necromancers "First Edition Feel", its all about the body count. Expect them to be high in a Necromancer module. The Goodman DCC's are usually much friendlier in that regard, with "Bloody Jacks Gold" and a certain lich being notable exceptions that I know of.

Oh, and DCC 35A is pretty friggin brutal too. Got to use your brains in that one.

Goodman is about the "First Edition Look". The only one that gave me a real strong first edition feel is the "Mysterious Tower", but I only own about half of the DCC's and have only thoroughly read about half of those, so I am by no means giving an informed opinion on that point.

I can say that I find both companies modules very useable and worth buying. That is an informed opinion. Whether or not you will agree is something your just going to have to find out for yourself, like we all do.

 

[Xyanthon]

Just to echo what some have said around here, both are pretty good. I too find that Necro's stuff tends to have more on the fleshed out story side, while DDCs are a good dungeon romp (at least from the ones I've read so far). So it really just depends on what you are looking for in your game.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I'm not sure I understand your "not interchangeable" statement Whizbang.

I mean they're not identical products, which you go on at length to agree with.

If you are "planning" your campaign ahead of time rather than running one and deciding you need a new module, they all are interchangeable.

If, if, if. They're not interchangeable, since they can't be used the exact same way. I can drop in any DCC of the right level/climate and it'll fit, since the outside the dungeon hooks and lore are minimal and designed to be replaced with something campaign specific.

Necromancer modules have more of a setting around them, with history, a larger environment and so on. One could strip all that away, but it's a lot more work. Necromancer modules are better used as intended -- as something the campaign works towards and around, instead of just a one-off side adventure, which DCCs are extremely well-suited for.

This doesn't make either better or worse, just different, like peanut butter and jelly. And like PB&J, they can work great together, but that still doesn't make them identical.

There's no need to ride to Necromancer's defense here, since there's no attack.

As for Necromancers "First Edition Feel", its all about the body count. Expect them to be high in a Necromancer module.

Well, First Edition feel means more than that to some consumers, which is why I said what I did about 1E.

The Goodman DCC's are usually much friendlier in that regard, with "Bloody Jacks Gold" and a certain lich being notable exceptions that I know of.

Their tournament modules are never a cakewalk. Vault of the Dragon Kings is apparently more deadly than Crypt of the Devil Lich, for instance, and I expect next year's (this year's GenCon tournament module) Palace in the Wastes to be a rough one as well, even if it wasn't quite as rough as Vault.

Goodman is about the "First Edition Look". The only one that gave me a real strong first edition feel is the "Mysterious Tower", but I only own about half of the DCC's and have only thoroughly read about half of those, so I am by no means giving an informed opinion on that point.

Every one of them gives me the same vibe I got from 1E TSR modules I played and DMed back in the day, although some of them channel a vibe from the lesser ones, like Ghost Tower of Iverness. They also have a fair number of modules that deliberately ape 1E modules, as Devil Lich does with Tomb of Horrors.

Necromancer modules feel closer in tone to a Judges Guild or (old school) White Dwarf adventure, as the tone tends to be a lot bleaker and more depressing. (White Dwarf D&D adventures were low magic in the most brutal and depressing way -- when the best magic item in a dungeon is a wand that creates normal cobwebs, that's low magic!) That's not a bad thing by any means: I like dark material.

 

[Treebore]

OK, then we pretty much view things the same. As for Goodman, up until Gencon I owned 5 DCC's plus two more that are for C&C, then I won the 12 module pack in the Ennies auctions, bought DCC 35 and a couple of more modules. Most of which I have yet found time to read through.

So I am definitely a lot less knowledgeable about the overall feel of the whole Goodman line than I am about Necromancer.

 

[trancejeremy]

A lot of Necromancer's stuff are basically almost mini-campaign settings. Usually a big dungeon or a lot of little ones around a town or village.

Usually you can drop the whole thing into your world without no problem. IMHO, most of their adventures are probably closer to 2e, than 1e, with the exception of something like T1-4 - Temple of Elemental Evil, where you had the town (Homlet) and then the dungeon nearby.

(Exception being Tomb of Abysthor (sp?), which is pretty much all dungeon, but is actually close to Bard's Gate, but that is described in another product, and Rappan Atthuk, which seems to be in the middle of nowhere, almost, and is almost all dungeon, outside of some very nasty widlerness encounters).

DCCs sometimes will have a town, but more often than not are just a dungeon crawl. And if there is a town, generally it's just a page description at most. They are probably more akin to the early 1e adventures.

 

[Blackwind]

Wow, thanks again guys. I really appreciate Whizbang, Treebore, and trancejeremy's discussion of some of the differences between Necromancer and Goodman modules. They both sound good, and I'm sure I'll eventually want to purchase a bunch from both lines, but I think I am going to start with a couple of Necromancer adventures. I like the fact that they include details about the surrounding town and wilderness areas; after all, you never know what those pesky PCs will get up to. Also, the difficulty level sounds about right for the type of campaign I want to run <evil grin>, and the darker, grittier, Judges Guild-esque flavor is right up my alley (at the moment, anyway). How about Wizard's Amulet, Crucible of Freya (including the extra online material), and Tomb of Abysthor? And then I could plant a few DCCs in the surrounding countryside for variety - any good ideas for side treks?

Oh, and what's the deal with Bard's Gate? Would it be good to have around if I am going to run Tomb of Abysthor?

I don't know why, but I have this fascination with the "old school" sword-and-sorcery game style even though it was sort of before my time. Maybe it has something to do with growing up in the 80s.

 

[Treebore]

Bards Gate is good. Make sure to get the extra pdf's from Bowbe, the author. It is easiest to find him on the Necromancer boards and posting the request in the Bards Gate forum.

I also love CSIO, and I love Endhome in Lost City of Barakus. Don't know why but Endhome clicked for me. The dungeon of Barakus is pretty darn good too.

Bards Gate is mentioned in Crucible and ToA, as well as RA, and several other Necromancer modules.

If your looking for other cities there is a thread about city supplements that has been popping up and down this board for the last week or two. Shouldn't be hard to find.

If you can find it DCC 3, I think it is, the name is "The Mysterious Tower", is a good module to use, and if the PC's are successful will give them a great bolt hole to safely run to. Well, safe once they get there.

I can't think of any others to pepper the area with right now. I know there are a couple that would fit in well, I am just unable to recall their names.

 

[Olaf the Stout]

I would say both. As previous posters have said, Necromancer and Goodman both offer slightly different experiences but I think that both companies adventures are modular enough that you can mix and match between the two.

The hard part is picking which adventures you actually want to run! I have that many that I want to use but only one session a fortnight to use them in. Considering how long my group is taking to finish the Freeport Trilogy, 5th edition will have been and gone before I get a chance to run all the cool adventures that I currently own.

Olaf the Stout

 

[Treebore]

I would say both. As previous posters have said, Necromancer and Goodman both offer slightly different experiences but I think that both companies adventures are modular enough that you can mix and match between the two.

The hard part is picking which adventures you actually want to run! I have that many that I want to use but only one session a fortnight to use them in. Considering how long my group is taking to finish the Freeport Trilogy, 5th edition will have been and gone before I get a chance to run all the cool adventures that I currently own.

Olaf the Stout

Tell me about it Olaf. I really should just quit buying modules and Dungeon magazine. I'm pretty sure I have enough to fully populate a whole setting with the various villages, towns, cities, and locations I have in all the various adventures I own.

I really should quit buying them.

I really should quit.

I really should.

I really...

CAN'T!!