Scum and Villainy (FitD)

[kenada]

What are opinions on when to have players make an action roll, or instead simply telling them they do what they said they want to do?

Say a PC goes to see an ally for information and sees the store getting raided by police, and decides to quickly leave to avoid getting seen by the cops. You could ask for a Skulk roll to leave unseen, and a 4/5 result could mean someone reports seeing a person immediately leaving the scene when seeing the police. But should you?
The task is trivially easy and in any other game I wouldn't ask for a roll. But SaV isn't a task resolution game, but a narrative game. I think you absolutely could ask for a roll every time a player announces an action and the game should still work.

Consort would be another good example. Most of the time when a PC asks an nonhostile NPC about something and the answer has no cost for the NPC, you can just give the player the answer. But calling for an action roll can introduce new complications, increase chaos, and give the players something to react to. Which does have its advantages, but I think when you do nonstop action or at least tension all the time, that would quickly become too much.

As GM, I can always apply my own judgement feeling the room. If I think the story is a bit slow and dragging right now, asking for a few action rolls even if they are in Controlled Position with Greater Effect could dial up the excitement, while at other times when I think slowing things down a bit would be good, I would give answers without any rolls. But that would create a situation in which things become arbitrary, with exactly the same kindnof action sometimes requiring a roll and sometimes not, dependent only on my mood as the GM.
My style as a D&D GM goes for maximum consistency to minimize the influence of my personal preferences, to give players greater agency over their choices and actions. But PtbA games specifically state that the GM should not be a disinterested party, but "be a fan of the players".

What are youtpr thoughts on this issue?

What are the stakes? If there are stakes, then roll. When I’m not sure, I ask the players. Otherwise, cut to the action (per the GM’s best practices in Scum and Villainy).

Another thing to keep in mind is that players shouldn’t be spending a lot of time doing research and planning. That’s what flashbacks are for. If they need information on a mission, they’ll hit a point where it becomes necessary, then they can flash back to how they used Consort to get it. If it turns out they don’t, then that’s great. They didn’t waste session time and possibly resources pursuing something that wouldn’t help them on their mission.

 

[Fenris-77]

Consort could be a lot of things. You might consort to try and get an introduction for example, probably to someone who wouldn't see you otherwise. You might consort to try and learn details of security or delivery arrangements. You might consort to try and find an asset or informer to run. You might consort to make friends and thus make a subsequent action easier (like now the guard knows you, or whatever). You might use consort to run specific kinds of surveillance too.

For example, when James Bond goes to play Baccarat he's probably making a Consort roll, as with any of the numerous examples in fiction and film where someone arranges to get invited to a party to get closer to a target or gather info.

 

[MarkB]

What are opinions on when to have players make an action roll, or instead simply telling them they do what they said they want to do?

Say a PC goes to see an ally for information and sees the store getting raided by police, and decides to quickly leave to avoid getting seen by the cops. You could ask for a Skulk roll to leave unseen, and a 4/5 result could mean someone reports seeing a person immediately leaving the scene when seeing the police. But should you?
The task is trivially easy and in any other game I wouldn't ask for a roll. But SaV isn't a task resolution game, but a narrative game. I think you absolutely could ask for a roll every time a player announces an action and the game should still work.

Consort would be another good example. Most of the time when a PC asks an nonhostile NPC about something and the answer has no cost for the NPC, you can just give the player the answer. But calling for an action roll can introduce new complications, increase chaos, and give the players something to react to. Which does have its advantages, but I think when you do nonstop action or at least tension all the time, that would quickly become too much.

As GM, I can always apply my own judgement feeling the room. If I think the story is a bit slow and dragging right now, asking for a few action rolls even if they are in Controlled Position with Greater Effect could dial up the excitement, while at other times when I think slowing things down a bit would be good, I would give answers without any rolls. But that would create a situation in which things become arbitrary, with exactly the same kindnof action sometimes requiring a roll and sometimes not, dependent only on my mood as the GM.
My style as a D&D GM goes for maximum consistency to minimize the influence of my personal preferences, to give players greater agency over their choices and actions. But PtbA games specifically state that the GM should not be a disinterested party, but "be a fan of the players".

What are youtpr thoughts on this issue?

Aside from @kenada s good advice on flashbacks vs pre-planning, how has the adventure got to the stage where things are so chilled-out in character?

The chilled-out asking around, consorting and the like is what the downtime phase is for. If we're into the action of a job, we should be dropping into it at the point where things get interesting.

If you've reached a point in the job where it stops being interesting to the point where anything the players want to do is defaulting to easier than Controlled / Greater Effect, just skip/speed through it to the next interesting bit. If you don't anticipate it getting interesting, call the job a success and skip to downtime.

And yes, your role is to be a fan of the players, but that's not the same as being a fan of the characters. For both you and the players, the goal should be to make the characters' lives as interesting as possible.

 

[hawkeyefan]

What are opinions on when to have players make an action roll, or instead simply telling them they do what they said they want to do?

When something interesting or meaningful may happen on a failure. So, when something is at stake.

For general info gathering or knowledge type rolls, you can likely just use a fortune roll. On a 1-3 they get basic knowledge/info. On a 4-5 they get a little more. On a 6 they get some really esoteric details.

Action rolls should be used for situations where something is at stake, as @kenada mentioned.

 

[Fenris-77]

I agree, but I'd only use a fortune roll there if the PCs didn't have a more interesting idea. If not, sure, Fortune.

 

[Umbran]

Now, I am having a specific question that I hope people can help me with. What exactly is the Consort action intended for?

I played S&V last weekend, and it was explained to me that it is basically a matter of who the target is:
Sway is what you use to convince people you don't know to do or believe something.
Command is what you use on people within a power structure.
Consort is what you use to convince someone you know, but who might not to want to take a risk you want them to take, or the like.

 

[Manbearcat]

Just think of Consort as a FitD instantiation of:

* Schmooze/(build) Rapport

* Streetwise (in D&D 4e)

* Circles in Burning Wheel family of games

 

[Ovinomancer]

I approach it from "what are you doing?"

Convincing some one? Sway.
Ordering someone? Command
Leaning on personal favors? Consort.

So, if I try and convince the copper to let me go using a bribe and swift talk, it's Sway. If I do it with threats, Command. If I reminisce about growing up together, Consort.

 

[pemerton]

When something interesting or meaningful may happen on a failure. So, when something is at stake.

What are the stakes? If there are stakes, then roll. When I’m not sure, I ask the players. Otherwise, cut to the action (per the GM’s best practices in Scum and Villainy).

Does BitD/FitD/S&V use "if you do it, you do it" as a basic principle?

 

[kenada]

Does BitD/FitD/S&V use "if you do it, you do it" as a basic principle?

It does not. The way it describes action rolls is more “say yes or roll the dice”.

You make an action roll when your character does something potentially dangerous or troublesome. The possible results of the action roll depend on your character’s position. There are three positions: controlled, risky, and desperate. If you’re in a controlled position, the possible consequences are less serious. If you’re in a desperate position, the consequences can be severe. If you’re somewhere in between, it’s risky—usually considered the “default” position for most actions.​

​

If there’s no danger or trouble at hand, you don’t make an action roll. You might make a fortune roll or a downtime roll or the GM will simply say yes—and you accomplish your goal.​