Special Edition Players Handbook....Meh

[DaveMage]

I disagree, I think that would be a very sleazy way to get non-collecters to buy the book, and if it were ~900 pages we could expect to pay several hundred dollars for it. The PHB is one of the core rulebooks, which the entire d20 license rests upon, so making special limited edition rules is not feasible anyway.

No, that's not what I'm saying!

No *new* rules should be added (no one should *have* to buy this), but creatable magic items from the DMG and other sources should be added as well as prestige classes and spells from existing sources - sort of an "all-in-one" edition.

Alternatively (or additionally) it would be cool if there were designer commentary regarding the rules and how they agreed or disagreed on various points.

 

[devilish]

WotC should have done what Monte Cook is doing with Arcana Evolved. He is upgrading the entire presentation, incorporating the setting book, and expanding with all new content. The book is going to be around 400pages, for $50. Thats a special edtion.

Hm....I was thinking that this was very similar to what
WOTC did with their players handbook. I didn't get the
sense that there would be any new content in it, just
all the character classes/monsters from existing publications
and errata. New artwork is nice but does it warrant a
new edition?

It's not like a new ruleset or an expansion or an improvement
like the differences between Psionics and Expanded Psionics are.

 

[Ranger REG]

Diaglo likes the backward compatiblity of d20. He buys the d20 books and mines them for ideas so he can convert them all to OD&D game stats. Nothing like a blackguard with a -10 AC...

Isn't that like taking apart a Lamborghini Diablo and turn it into one of those kiddie's red pull wagons?

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

WotC should have done what Monte Cook is doing with Arcana Evolved. He is upgrading the entire presentation, incorporating the setting book, and expanding with all new content. The book is going to be around 400pages, for $50. Thats a special edtion.

Wizards offers a special cover, with no new content. They just fixes the goofs in the orginal. This is worst than what the comic industry does when they put out the same comic with mutltiple covers. It's just a ploy to seperate people and there money. Though, at least with the comics, they usualy don't charge you more than twice the price for a special cover.

While I like AU, I've got a serious problem with AE being compared to the Special Edition PHB. Why? Well, WotC didn't talk about a revision coming too early and then turn around and throw out the SEPHB. Has everyone forgotten the huge deal with Monte Cook's rant about 3.5? I'm sorry, but after that, turning around and revising AU(even WITH added content from other books) with barely a year passing is just not comparable. Though I guess my problem is more with the fans who went crazy against 3.5 because "Monte said we don't need it!"(even though that's not what he was really saying), and now he does his own 'revision' of sorts and everyone loves it without a second thought.

With the SEPHB, we were TOLD what it was. I fall into the catgory of not wanting it...and then wondering why people are disappointed in something they already knew about(especially if you've been on ENWorld)

 

[Mystery Man]

With the SEPHB, we were TOLD what it was. I fall into the catgory of not wanting it...and then wondering why people are disappointed in something they already knew about(especially if you've been on ENWorld)

I personally am not disappointed rather, unimpressed. More to the leather cover than anything. It just could have been done a bit more "special". And the paper could have been of higher quality, with perhaps gold lining on edges. That would be more in line with a Special Edition for me.

Though I guess my problem is more with the fans who went crazy against 3.5 because "Monte said we don't need it!"(even though that's not what he was really saying), and now he does his own 'revision' of sorts and everyone loves it without a second thought.

Spun that way it does sound a bit hypocritical doesn't it? Of course I personally never bought into AU and never will so...

 

[Chun-tzu]

No *new* rules should be added (no one should *have* to buy this), but creatable magic items from the DMG and other sources should be added as well as prestige classes and spells from existing sources - sort of an "all-in-one" edition.

Alternatively (or additionally) it would be cool if there were designer commentary regarding the rules and how they agreed or disagreed on various points.

No, no, that's the Extended edition, coming out just in time for Christmas. Then, next summer they'll release the Unrated edition. Rumor has it we'll see naked nymphs and demons again, but I'm betting it'll just have all the iconics dressed like Hennet, in leather and spikes.

 

[DeadlyUematsu]

If they had did it like AE, it would have been a definite mustbuy. I mean, throw in the racial subclasses for dwarves, elves, halfling, and gnomes, assassin as a core character class, the content of the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer, and I would have bought two or three.

 

[Turjan]

Though I guess my problem is more with the fans who went crazy against 3.5 because "Monte said we don't need it!"(even though that's not what he was really saying), and now he does his own 'revision' of sorts and everyone loves it without a second thought.

AE is not supposed to be a revision. It will contain errata, nearly exclusively old stuff from a few published books and very few new snippets (like a new witch variant, etc.). As far as I understood, Monte Cook won't revise AU. The rules will stay the same, and the errata will be downloadable for free. If it is true what he advertises, the main purpose of AE is to make the book look pretty. The old AU books will still be usable as they are.

This comes from someone who likes the AU rules (I find them very interesting), but I'm not someone you would call a "Monte Cook fan".

As far as the PHB special edition is concerned, I don't see the point in complaining. It's just a nice-looking version of the PHB. I find it a very comforting thought that the PHB will still remain the same, contentwise.

 

[Nightcloak]

While I like AU, I've got a serious problem with AE being compared to the Special Edition PHB. Why? Well, WotC didn't talk about a revision coming too early and then turn around and throw out the SEPHB. Has everyone forgotten the huge deal with Monte Cook's rant about 3.5? I'm sorry, but after that, turning around and revising AU(even WITH added content from other books) with barely a year passing is just not comparable.

Actually, Monte points out that you don't need the AE to play an AU campaign - because it is not a revision. It's just a collection of existing books, including AU, printed in full color with new art work for the fans. Some extra goodness is thrown in like epic level progression and some new options for classes with sub-choices (like the witch or champion). In other words, it is a special edition in the proper sense of the word - A book for the core fans. It would be great to have, but you don't need it at all to play AU. This differs greatly from the release of 3.5 in that you were expected to update to actual rule changes.

If the SEPH was a collection of the core rules and player options, printed with new art work, with extra choices for characters and epic pregressions thrown in then it would be special and this debate wouldn't be taking place



Alright, I'm not fooling anyone... Of course we would still have this debate

Though I guess my problem is more with the fans who went crazy against 3.5 because "Monte said we don't need it!"(even though that's not what he was really saying)

I'm 100% with ya.

 

[Nightcloak]

Sorry about that Turjan, you posted while I was typing

I really need to learn to type faster...

This comes from someone who likes the AU rules (I find them very interesting), but I'm not someone you would call a "Monte Cook fan".

Except I am a MC fan.

As far as the PHB special edition is concerned, I don't see the point in complaining. It's just a nice-looking version of the PHB.

That is true, we did know what was comming. It's not like they suprised us with the content or anything. Of course, us gamers like to add our 2 cps. on all subjects game related.

I think it is an actual compulsion