Spelljammer Spelljammer Shows Up In The Wild - Check Out The Tables of Contents

Copies of Spelljammer are starting to show up. Mike Long of Tribality is in receipt of the books and has tweeted some photos!

 

[Yaarel]

This is the one bit of your post that really doesn't work for me. IMO, defiling needs to be an option available to all arcane casters at almost any time - it needs to be an ever-present temptation to take the easy way out at the cost of destroying the world. Gating it behind a feat (or background, or indeed and opt-in or opt-out mechanic) robs it of that value.

Huh. On rereading the Defiler according to the original 1991 Dark Sun Setting Guide, I have to agree with you. I feel the original Dark Sun is the one 5e must prioritize.

The original concept is: defiling is "easy", but preserving is "difficult".

Note, there are two kinds of Defilers. One is servants of a sorcerer king. The other is persecuted by sorcerer kings (for disobedience) and by everyone else (for destroying the planet). Later supplements have the sorcerer kings secretly training their Defilers. Implying the knowledge of how to defile is difficult to obtain. But the original Dark Sun makes it clear that anyone who wants to defile, can, easily.

That said. The original Dark Sun has something like two separate Wizard subclasses, one for Defiling and an other for Preserving. These separate subclasses can easily be two separate 5e feats. For 5e, the only real concern is mechanical gaming balance. Whatever mechanics can grant a satisfying Defile effect while maintaining balance, is fine for 5e. If investing in a feat is necessary to gain the design space for a satisfying effect, then fine. If it is possible to find the design space in some other balanced way, then also fine.

The main point of the 2e Defiler is, this kind of Wizard gains class levels at a faster rate than the normal 2e Wizard class. This approach where some player characters are higher level than other player characters is less suitable for 5e. But this precociousness can inspire 5e mechanics. The challenge is maintaining 5e gaming balance.



Maybe "Defilement" is a "supernatural region"? (see Tashas, Environmental Hazards, 150). In the 1991 2e Dark Sun setting, a unique arcane event has fundamentally altered the nature of the elements. "The essence of every living thing, from the highest to the lowest, has been warped in some grotesque way that makes it more vicious, more cunning, and more terrifying than its [ancient] forebears. ... Perhaps it was the influence of a sinister power. ... Perhaps, as some say, the dragon itself is at the heart of the matter." This arcane event effectively transforms plant life into an easily accessible supernatural region. When in this region − namely when within 10 feet of lush plant life − the arcane spell caster gains the following effects.

The destruction of the adjacent plant life spontaneously grants the Wizard a free spell slot when using an action to cast an arcane spell. The more lush the plant life, the higher the spell level of this one slot can be. Most plant life is a form of cactus. Cactuses tend to be one of the few sources of water. Any Wizard recognizes what spell level a particular patch of plants can yield. (It is an Easy challenge, but a DM doesnt require an Arcane skill check unless there are unusual circumstances. That make the check more difficult.) The Wizard destroys the plants instead of expending ones own spell slots.

The above can probably happen during gameplay in a balanced way because the plant life is itself is quite rare. Also, this supernatural region is unique to planet Athas, so players cannot transport into verdant settings where plant life is ubiquitous.



Note. According to the 1991 Dark Sun, only the dragon is able to extract living energy from living creatures, instantly killing living beings, in a way that can freely cast arcane spells even in barren landscapes. At least, narratively: "Even the sorcerer kings are not the most dread users of defiler magic: the great dragon’s defiler magic is so powerful that it destroys living animals as well." But mechanically, the Dragon of Tyr is a unique epic level monster 20+, whose only anti-life traits are PSIONIC powers: Death Field and Life Draining. Other monsters can have these two powers too. The monster entry doesnt mention defiling, except that it has Defiler spells.

Similarly, 5e Spelljammer has psionic creatures whose traits can extract living energy in order to restore its own hit points. Effectively, using defiling for a vampiric benefit. What is unique about the 5e Defile trait is that it destroys plants as well.

However, for a 5e Dark Sun setting, when using Defile to fuel arcane spells, only plants are easy enough to derive benefit from. Only the epic levels of dragon can gain the epic boon of extracting arcane fuel directly from living creatures.


Heh, everything about a 5e Dark Sun is an approximation and a translation of 2e Dark Sun. Even the 2e Dark Sun itself is inconsistent at times.

 

[Yaarel]

DARK SUN TIMELINE (1995 2e Dark Sun Campaign Setting)

-8,000 (Time of Magic)

• Rajaat discovers the principles of magic, heretofore unknown on Athas.

• Rajaat publicly teaches the techniques of preserving magic, while secretly teaching a select group of students the ways of defiling magic. From this group he selects the most powerful defiler/psionicists to become his Champions.

• Rajaat uses the Pristine Tower to focus the sun’s energy, seeking to elevate his Champions’ powers. He succeeds, but the sun turns a dark crimson.

- 3,500 (Cleaning Wars)

• Rajaat orders his Champions to destroy the races created during the Rebirth in an effort to return the world to the Blue Age.

• Many of the nonhuman races are eliminated, including gnomes, lizard men, and orcs.

• The Champions discover that Rajaat plans to give the world to the halflings, not the humans. Led by Borys, the Champions revolt and Rajaat is trapped within the Hollow.

- 2,000 (Sorcerer Kings)

• The remaining Champions become the sorcerer kings, each claiming one of the city-states of the Tyr Region to rule.

• The sorcerer kings gain godlike powers, including the ability to grant spells to their templars.

• Borys is transformed into the Dragon, a creature of power never before seen on Athas.

• The devastation of the world begun in the last age continues as the sorcerer kings engage in ever greater defiling magic.



-77 to Present (Heroism)

• King Kalak is assassinated and Tyr becomes a free city.

• Rajaat is freed from the Hollow, but only momentarily before he is once again imprisoned.

• Only three sorcerer kings remain after major events transpire − events that lead to the death of the Dragon and the creation of the Cerulean Storm.

• The Great Earthquake rips through the Tyr Region, opening paths to the lands beyond the cradle of Athasian civilization.



Comments

The timeline before Year -77 spells out the original 2e Dark Sun setting in 1991. This is the setting that 5e needs to model.

There can be sorcerer kings that are striving to become a defiler dragon, like Borys.

But afterward, from Year -77 onward, a time of Heroism has destroyed the original 2e Dark Sun setting. The 2e Revised Dark Sun setting in 1995 describes a new setting, the aftermath of the destruction of the original setting.

Furthermore, the Revised introduces new setting concepts, such as "The Hollow". In 5e terms, the Hollow is something like a prison demiplane, located in a part of the Shadowfell that doesnt overlap the material plane. Actually, it seems fair to say, the Hollow is a 5e Shadowfell "Domain of Dread", comparing to those in Ravenloft, except its Dark Lord is Rajaat. However references to such aspects of cosmology deviate from the themes and tropes of the original Dark Sun setting.

Helpfully, the 1995 setting clarifies how defiling of the original 1991 setting works.

"When Rajaat’s Champions combined their magic with the Dark Lens to become sorcerer kings, the resulting storm of energy connected them to all the elemental planes. This opened magical conduits through which elemental priest magic could be drawn from. The sorcerer kings couldn’t use this magic themselves, but they could bestow spellcasting abilities on their most loyal servants. These priests, dedicated to a single sorcerer king, are called templars. The opening of the magical conduits to the elemental planes was a unique effect of the events that created the sorcerer kings. It can’t be duplicated, so no new sorcerer kings will ever gain the ability to grant their followers priest spells. Currently, templars with the ability to cast priest spells exist only in the city-states."

This arcane event that breached the divine power source is also what caused the sun to become "Dark" crimson.

"The sorcerer kings are defilers of the highest order, and they combine wizardry with psionics. They can draw energy for spells from not only plants, but from all living things − including animals and humans. This makes the sorcerer kings extremely powerful and very dangerous to the world and its inhabitants."

So in the later 1995 setting, it turns out that the sorcerer kings can also derive arcane energy from living creatures. In the original 1991 setting, only Borys the dragon could do this. Perhaps, earlier the sorcerer kings were not yet powerful enough to do so. But after some time, became dragon-like enough, by gaining enough Defiler levels, to learn how to do this.

 

[overgeeked]

Maybe we should start a Dark Sun thread so we can talk about Spelljammer.

 

[darjr]

 

[darjr]

And another. Here is a still if the inside of the DM screen.

 

[Maxperson]

This is the one bit of your post that really doesn't work for me. IMO, defiling needs to be an option available to all arcane casters at almost any time - it needs to be an ever-present temptation to take the easy way out at the cost of destroying the world. Gating it behind a feat (or background, or indeed and opt-in or opt-out mechanic) robs it of that value.

I don't agree with that. Dark Sun could have a rule that all arcane casters must pick either the Defiler or Preserve background. Backgrounds as we know from the UA are going to be coming with free feats attached at 1st and perhaps 4th level. Those feats could provide those who pick the Defiler background an ever present temptation to take the easy way at the cost of destroying the world.

 

[pukunui]

I don't agree with that. Dark Sun could have a rule that all arcane casters must pick either the Defiler or Preserve background. Backgrounds as we know from the UA are going to be coming with free feats attached at 1st and perhaps 4th level. Those feats could provide those who pick the Defiler background an ever present temptation to take the easy way at the cost of destroying the world.

But preserving and defiling aren’t mutually exclusive. You can alternate between them. Isn’t that what Sadira does in the Prism Pentad?

I think preserving and defiling need to be open-ended rules for the setting that anyone who can use arcane magic can do, rather than something gated behind a background and/or feat or even a subclass or whatever.

 

[Maxperson]

But preserving and defiling aren’t mutually exclusive. You can alternate between them. Isn’t that what Sadira does in the Prism Pentad?

I think preserving and defiling need to be open-ended rules for the setting that anyone who can use arcane magic can do, rather than something gated behind a background and/or feat or even a subclass or whatever.

I'm pretty sure you couldn't switch between them in 2e. They had different experience charts. Perhaps Sadira was something special. Was she in a novel? Novels get away with things due to the power of plot.

"All wizards must decide at the beginning of their careers whether they are trying to work with nature or without regard for it. In Dark Sun, this means a wizard must be either a defiler or a preserver."

And...

"Defilers are wizards who have decided to take a faster, darker approach to mastering the use of magical spells. In the give and take of spell casting, defilers are well versed in the taking, but give nothing in return. With every spell cast, a defiler leeches the life-energy out of the plants and soil around him, leaving a lifeless zone. Because of this, defilers can only have non-good alignments."

And...

"The preserver is a wizard of the old, established school of magic. In the give and take of spell casting, preservers have mastered the balance. A preserver's magical spells are cast in harmony with nature. When a preserver casts a spell, there is no damage to the nearby environment."

They were written up like separate wizard subclasses like the illusionist was.

Edit: Corrected a typo

 

[pukunui]

Yes, Sadira is one of the main characters in the novel series. It's been a loooong time since I read the 2e rules, so I guess I was misremembering.

 

[overgeeked]

Yes, Sadira is one of the main characters in the novel series. It's been a loooong time since I read the 2e rules, so I guess I was misremembering.

The rules in the box don’t match the fiction in the novels. You’re either, or according to the rules. But in the fiction you have to choose with every spell cast whether you defile or preserve.

So, how about Spelljammer? I hear that’s coming out soon.