D&D 5E Treantmonk's Guide to Wizards 5e

[FormerlyHemlock]

Heck, now I'm really wondering about dipping into this for a multiclass w/ my illusion-focused warlock. Granted, his WIS sucks - but thematically so delicious.

Per PHB 163, you need a Wisdom of at least 13 to multiclass to/from cleric.

 

[Celtavian]

The concentrationn requirement suggests to me that you wouldn't be able to have four duplicates operating simultaneously.

Level 17 ability gives four duplicates.

It only lasts for a minute. In order to exploit it you'd need to have a way of casting the spell such that other people don't notice you dominating the target, and then leveraging that hidden advantage somehow within the next sixty seconds.

Higher level spell slot extends duration.

I'm always thinking in terms of what I can do at higher level. I know most players don't expect to get past level 7 to 10. I expect to get to level 14 to 18. Very rare our campaigns don't make it to that level range. I'm hoping we can reach 20 more often in 5E given the game scales better at high level.

 

[Treantmonklvl20]

Another name for Gate is Phandaal's Infallible Kidnapping. If you want to mug somebody, just Plane Shift to a different plane and then cast Gate on them.

That does seem to be the most likely use for the spell now.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

Level 17 ability gives four duplicates.

Higher level spell slot extends duration.

I'm always thinking in terms of what I can do at higher level. I know most players don't expect to get past level 7 to 10. I expect to get to level 14 to 18. Very rare our campaigns don't make it to that level range. I'm hoping we can reach 20 more often in 5E given the game scales better at high level.

Thanks for explaining. It's still tough for me to see a scenario where Dominate Person is a better "deceive" option than Magic Jar for anybody but an Enchanter, but at least it's usable for short-term hijinks. And it's cheaper too.

Incidentally, it appears that werebears are now the targets of choice for Magic Jar shenanigans. No more tarrasques. Unless you True Polymorph the tarrasque into a humanoid first, and then release the polymorph after you've possessed the humanoid, at which point it reverts to being a tarrasque.

 

[Celtavian]

Thanks for explaining. It's still tough for me to see a scenario where Dominate Person is a better "deceive" option than Magic Jar for anybody but an Enchanter, but at least it's usable for short-term hijinks. And it's cheaper too.

Incidentally, it appears that werebears are now the targets of choice for Magic Jar shenanigans. No more tarrasques. Unless you True Polymorph the tarrasque into a humanoid first, and then release the polymorph after you've possessed the humanoid, at which point it reverts to being a tarrasque.

Hmm. Doesn't magic jar still require you to leave your body whereas with dominate person you can use the dominated target to attack while you attack with your own body? You can't see situations where that would be better?

 

[Leatherhead]

I was going to 'correct' you that a fog cloud isn't "an object or a creature" but looked up wording to see "or some other visible phenomenon"
An orderless thick black smoke cloud would be difficult to 'interact with', so should save you from it being dismissed with a free action wave of the hand, saved as part of a move action, or even suffering disadvantage with the first attack made in it. The only way to save against it would be to spend an _action_ investigating it.

They could move out of the range, but then....
"You can use your action to cause the image to move to any spot within range."

I'm also wondering if it were cast over the only window, would it block all light from entering the room from the window?

Even better than casting it on your enemy is casting it on your allies, like your friendly roguish crossbow sniper. They know it's fake, so it doesn't bug them, but they still reap all the benefits of attacking from an obscured area.

 

[Treantmonklvl20]

UPDATE: Both guides are now updated to include Elemental Evil options. Skip to the bottom to see this content.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

It's still tough for me to see a scenario where Dominate Person is a better "deceive" option than Magic Jar for anybody but an Enchanter, but at least it's usable for short-term hijinks. And it's cheaper too.

Hmm. Doesn't magic jar still require you to leave your body whereas with dominate person you can use the dominated target to attack while you attack with your own body? You can't see situations where that would be better?

I said "better 'deceive' option," by which I meant a long-term deception like taking over a kingdom by becoming the queen, or breaking a spy ring by becoming one of their members. When you're running a deception like that, DPR isn't really a consideration. I get the idea that your games are pretty much combat-oriented. In the Contagion thread you said that "plot" spells like Dausuul's Contagion should not even be in the PHB, and using Magic Jar to run a long-lasting deception is pretty much on par with Dausuul's Contagion, so I expect in your games you'd call Magic Jar usages like the above a "plot spell" which you wouldn't do. Dominate Person will then be superior for you, for the reasons you listed and the fact that it's cheaper to cast, and that the downside isn't a downside for you. That's what I meant by "at least [Dominate Person]'s useful for short-term hijinks."

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

Thanks for the Elemental Evil update, Treeantmonk. I think you are undervaluing Absorb Elements.

Absorb elements (abjuration): This isn’t a bad spell, but it’s really tailored more to a melee combatant than a Wizard. The resistance ability is all you are really getting here, and it’s of course a bit late unless you expect to take more of the same this round.

The resistance isn't late at all. It reduces the damage you take from that attack. From the spell description:

The spell captures some of the incoming energy, lessening its effect on you and storing it for your next melee attack. You have resistance to the triggering damage type until the start of your next turn.

Clearly the resistance isn't late, it's right on time. Melee vs. non-melee, meh, who cares about the bonus 1d6 damage. What the wizard cares about is that when the Ancient Red Dragon breathes on him for 91 points of damage, and he fails his Dex save (90% likely), instead of taking 91 points of damage he casts Absorb Elements and takes 45 instead.

It's a pretty fantastically good reaction spell to have access to, so much so that I don't let my players have it unless they find it in treasure. It's like a permanent "Resistance to All Elements" spell with no Concentration issues.

 

[Coredump]

Thanks for the Elemental Evil update, Treeantmonk. I think you are undervaluing Absorb Elements.



The resistance isn't late at all. It reduces the damage you take from that attack. From the spell description:



Clearly the resistance isn't late, it's right on time. Melee vs. non-melee, meh, who cares about the bonus 1d6 damage. What the wizard cares about is that when the Ancient Red Dragon breathes on him for 91 points of damage, and he fails his Dex save (90% likely), instead of taking 91 points of damage he casts Absorb Elements and takes 45 instead.

It's a pretty fantastically good reaction spell to have access to, so much so that I don't let my players have it unless they find it in treasure. It's like a permanent "Resistance to All Elements" spell with no Concentration issues.

That is the way I read it also. It is a Shield spell tailored for elemental attacks.