Vampiring with necromancy, warlocking

[Warpiglet]

I know how Grim Harvest works.

With only 2 levels of wizard, you will have 3 1st level long rest spell slots.

No it won't be tricky as to whether or not the Hex damage will actually kill a creature. The solution is to roll the damage separately. You can choose of you want the damage to come before or after by rolling it before or after the melee damage, but you'll have to live with the result. Or your DM could just say no. As a DM, I would just rule no, just because of the intent of the ability vs the nature of the spell. Just to keep it from being an unbalanced, overpowered ability.

sure. but as to overpowered? I don't think healing two to three with a hex would be that much.

I might however go with hex and the invocation maddening hex (I think is the one) that does area damage in effect. I do believe that would work. I would use a lowly 1st level wizard slot for that and surely hex and the invocation would be considered a spell and not a weapon.

I think the general thought so far is its about as good as is its going to get barring a few of the new spells.

I do not think it would do anything with a cantrip however since it says "spell level" unless I am wrong about that.

 

[neogod22]

sure. but as to overpowered? I don't think healing two to three with a hex would be that much.

I might however go with hex and the invocation maddening hex (I think is the one) that does area damage in effect. I do believe that would work. I would use a lowly 1st level wizard slot for that and surely hex and the invocation would be considered a spell and not a weapon.

I think the general thought so far is its about as good as is its going to get barring a few of the new spells.

I do not think it would do anything with a cantrip however since it says "spell level" unless I am wrong about that.

It's overpowered because can move from target to target. When you're casting it at 5th level, and you're getting 10hp per kill, that's way too powerful.

 

[neogod22]

It's overpowered because can move from target to target. When you're casting it at 5th level, and you're getting 10hp per kill, that's way too powerful.

This is the reason Hexblade curse only effects 1 target, and when you get the level 14 ability, and can move it from target to target, you don't heal.

 

[Warpiglet]

This is the reason Hexblade curse only effects 1 target, and when you get the level 14 ability, and can move it from target to target, you don't heal.

we are talking about two different things. I am talking about the 1st level spell, hex as used with a weapon. It will never net 10 per kill, only 2 or 3.

 

[neogod22]

we are talking about two different things. I am talking about the 1st level spell, hex as used with a weapon. It will never net 10 per kill, only 2 or 3.

You're talking about combining a spell with an ability. At level 3, all spells cast from your warlock slots are 2nd lvl. Which means from harvest will give you back 4hp or 6hp (if the spell is from the Necromancy school), and it only goes up. The only way you would be able to cast any spell at lvl 1 is if you used your wizard slots.

Whether or not you attempted to use the example that Hex is a 1st level spell to try and hide the ability to exploit this combination. As someone who plays and DMs have to be weary of this and make rulings that don't allow things to be exploited in this nature. Also, even at low levels, small amount of HP per kill is still overpowered.

 

[Warpiglet]

You're talking about combining a spell with an ability. At level 3, all spells cast from your warlock slots are 2nd lvl. Which means from harvest will give you back 4hp or 6hp (if the spell is from the Necromancy school), and it only goes up. The only way you would be able to cast any spell at lvl 1 is if you used your wizard slots.

Whether or not you attempted to use the example that Hex is a 1st level spell to try and hide the ability to exploit this combination. As someone who plays and DMs have to be weary of this and make rulings that don't allow things to be exploited in this nature. Also, even at low levels, small amount of HP per kill is still overpowered.

I note the terms "Hide" and "exploit."

Ok thanks for the input. I asked for opinions and you have kindly obliged.

It's hard to get tone from internet but you seem frustrated. Here is to your future gaming free of scoundrels trying to cheat!

 

[neogod22]

I note the terms "Hide" and "exploit."

Ok thanks for the input. I asked for opinions and you have kindly obliged.

It's hard to get tone from internet but you seem frustrated. Here is to your future gaming free of scoundrels trying to cheat!

I'm not frustrated. Like I said. People try and find loopholes to cheat, especially on the forums. I didn't call you a cheater, I just expressed that it was overpowered and listed the reasons. You rebutted that it's a level one spell, and I reminded you that that's not how warlock casting works. Which I told you, this is exactly why Hexblade's Curse is the way it is, because it basically has the same ability.

 

[Warpiglet]

I'm not frustrated. Like I said. People try and find loopholes to cheat, especially on the forums. I didn't call you a cheater, I just expressed that it was overpowered and listed the reasons. You rebutted that it's a level one spell, and I reminded you that that's not how warlock casting works. Which I told you, this is exactly why Hexblade's Curse is the way it is, because it basically has the same ability.

Very good, then. I also should have added that I was referencing a hex via a level one wizard slot. I do not like using higher slots for hex since I do not like eldritch blast/hex combos and like higher level spells generally.

What I am trying to do is find a different viable way to use this combination which was chanced upon. While others will have 2 attacks and a feat at level five, I will have 3 levels of warlock and two wizard with no feats and one attack. It is a suboptimal choice. Add to that the fact I am using point buy and others rolled high stats, I am looking for ways to stay on my feet and not drag everyone down since I could not afford the highest con.

I think this will help to accomplish my goal, but did not know if I missed anything useful. I am no fan of cheese to be blunt and don't think some auto heal will tip the scales. I really might be better off racing to fifth and taking tomb of levistus and pumping up armor of agathys for staying power.

this all came about from backstory which calls for a raven familiar...but I digress.

 

[neogod22]

Very good, then. I also should have added that I was referencing a hex via a level one wizard slot. I do not like using higher slots for hex since I do not like eldritch blast/hex combos and like higher level spells generally.

What I am trying to do is find a different viable way to use this combination which was chanced upon. While others will have 2 attacks and a feat at level five, I will have 3 levels of warlock and two wizard with no feats and one attack. It is a suboptimal choice. Add to that the fact I am using point buy and others rolled high stats, I am looking for ways to stay on my feet and not drag everyone down since I could not afford the highest con.

I think this will help to accomplish my goal, but did not know if I missed anything useful. I am no fan of cheese to be blunt and don't think some auto heal will tip the scales. I really might be better off racing to fifth and taking tomb of levistus and pumping up armor of agathys for staying power.

this all came about from backstory which calls for a raven familiar...but I digress.

What is your end goal for your character? It seems like a bad idea to multiclass at 4th level. If the main reason is to have a pet raven, I'm guessing because you want to have a pact with the Raven Queen, why not just go ask to go with the Raven Queen pact warlock? It's actually a better Pact in my opinion.

If that isn't an option, then how about pact of the tome Hexblade. Sure you can't create a magic weapon, but you can still use any weapon with your CHA modifier. Then you can take the invocation that gives you ritual caster, and get Find Familiar as a ritual.

A third option, is to just ask for a pet raven. It doesn't do anything special, but be a pet.

 

[Warpiglet]

What is your end goal for your character? It seems like a bad idea to multiclass at 4th level. If the main reason is to have a pet raven, I'm guessing because you want to have a pact with the Raven Queen, why not just go ask to go with the Raven Queen pact warlock? It's actually a better Pact in my opinion.

If that isn't an option, then how about pact of the tome Hexblade. Sure you can't create a magic weapon, but you can still use any weapon with your CHA modifier. Then you can take the invocation that gives you ritual caster, and get Find Familiar as a ritual.

A third option, is to just ask for a pet raven. It doesn't do anything special, but be a pet.

I could in fact go for the chain pact...or ask for a pet. The former might be a better idea. However, I really wanted to see if I could play a melee centric warlock

The story is that the character's family (a barony) and the lord's advisor (a wizard) are killed. The character dabbled in warlock powers against the wizard's council before this. Being a chance taker, the character becomes obsessed with contacting the dead. The character sees a dark shape which advises him (from the shadowfell) and thinks it is a perhaps a lost relative (might be something more sinister...mind those quija boards!). Crows/ravens visit him often and he thinks this is a manifestation of the kindly old wizard.

So...I was going to have a "normal" familiar--a raven--and have the character seem? to talk to him and get council even though no one else hears anything. It was more a roleplaying thing. Technically yes, a DM granted pet would work.

Secondarily, in addition to warlocking, the character was in a secret order of Wee Jas. So it all started coming together...multiclass warlock and wizard, get familiar, gain necromancer powers and the whole story comes full circle.

THEN I was looking for ways this might be leveraged for effectiveness in combat...

There are simply limitations. I just noted grim harvest only works ONCE A TURN and so it will not be any kind of character defining ability.