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D&D 5E What are the "True Issues" with 5e?

Player: "I look closely at the mural to see if it rings any bells about what I learned during my days working as a librarian"
DM: "Give me a DC 10 Intelligence(History) roll. Succeed and I'll tell you some important info about the mural. Fail, and you'll just get some basic, fuzzier details."
One thing that I’d like to see in the new edition that a lot of DMs do anyway, is that certain skill rolls require training to be able to attempt: for instance, in order to attempt to decipher the runes, you need training in Arcana.

It is something I’ve seen people complain about on forums, but in all games I’ve played, it is acknowledged that for some uses of skills, you need to be trained to attempt the check.
 

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James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
While letting anyone roll for any check makes proficiency seem less special (especially when the bonuses are low, so the Int 8 Barbarian can still get a 19 on an Arcana check while the 16 Int Wizard can roll as low as 6), I'm not keen on gatekeeping; characters don't get a lot of skills to begin with, so there's always something the group won't have covered.

OTOH there is some precedent for this RAW; as I recall, you must be proficient with Thieves' Tools in order to disable a trap according to the PHB.
 

OTOH there is some precedent for this RAW; as I recall, you must be proficient with Thieves' Tools in order to disable a trap according to the PHB.
The general rule concerning checks also applies: you can only attempt a check if you have a chance of success. My experience on the forums and with more first-time DMs is that this guidance is insufficient, specific guidance concerning skill rolls would be helpful.

As to your first point, I have never seen this used more often than sparingly. Generally, it is only used for certain knowledge checks, where someone either has the knowledge or doesn’t.
 

nevin

Hero
I'm slowly coming to the opinion that skills should reflect the training the character and expand the checks a character can make but that some sort of modified ability check should just be used. I think Skills have gotten out of hand and the game take more from it than they add to it in thier current form. I don't have any answers but I'd love to see skills completly redone into something more simple, better defined.
 


M_Natas

Hero
I'm slowly coming to the opinion that skills should reflect the training the character and expand the checks a character can make but that some sort of modified ability check should just be used. I think Skills have gotten out of hand and the game take more from it than they add to it in thier current form. I don't have any answers but I'd love to see skills completly redone into something more simple, better defined.
The problem is, by RAW characters make ability checks for everything and when the situation warrants it (by DM discretion) a Skill proficiency can be added as a bonus. But most of the times at the table it is played as Skill checks and ability checks are ignored (except maybe strength).
I mean, I as the DM also fall in that trap and look first at the Skill list and only if I find nothing that could cover it I look at the abilities, even though I know I should do it the other way around. But the layout of the character sheet makes those skills very prominent.
 

nevin

Hero
The problem is, by RAW characters make ability checks for everything and when the situation warrants it (by DM discretion) a Skill proficiency can be added as a bonus. But most of the times at the table it is played as Skill checks and ability checks are ignored (except maybe strength).
I mean, I as the DM also fall in that trap and look first at the Skill list and only if I find nothing that could cover it I look at the abilities, even though I know I should do it the other way around. But the layout of the character sheet makes those skills very prominent.
No skills like Spells are designed to overcome challenges that can't be overcome with the standard roleplaying or fighting. The more liberal the DM is with the use of them the easier it is to simply bypass things with a skill check. It's not because skills are more prominant on the sheet. it's because a lazy DM, can actually turn a skill monkey into a god who just bypasses most encounters with one roll.
 

Oofta

Legend
No skills like Spells are designed to overcome challenges that can't be overcome with the standard roleplaying or fighting. The more liberal the DM is with the use of them the easier it is to simply bypass things with a skill check. It's not because skills are more prominant on the sheet. it's because a lazy DM, can actually turn a skill monkey into a god who just bypasses most encounters with one roll.

Meanwhile a DM can also totally ignore skills and make the investment I made at a well rounded character instead of focusing totally on combat totally irrelevant. I don't see having a skilled character and letting the player actually be useful a bad thing. If one PC is dominating, I'll take steps to try to avoid it but I'm not going to penalize someone for building their PC "wrong".
 

nevin

Hero
Meanwhile a DM can also totally ignore skills and make the investment I made at a well rounded character instead of focusing totally on combat totally irrelevant. I don't see having a skilled character and letting the player actually be useful a bad thing. If one PC is dominating, I'll take steps to try to avoid it but I'm not going to penalize someone for building their PC "wrong".
That's an entire different discussion We'd both probably agree on. I always hand out magic items or Dm special powers to keep the players on par. But the skill system since it's inception in 2e has always been a clunky bolt on poorly explained mess that gets run differently at different tables. some tables the DM listens to what is said , how it's roleplayed etc then takes into account the bluff check. I;ve seen other DM's just have one player roll a bluff check against another player and say you're scared you won't argue anymore. It's never worked right without constant Dm fiddling.
 

Oofta

Legend
That's an entire different discussion We'd both probably agree on. I always hand out magic items or Dm special powers to keep the players on par. But the skill system since it's inception in 2e has always been a clunky bolt on poorly explained mess that gets run differently at different tables. some tables the DM listens to what is said , how it's roleplayed etc then takes into account the bluff check. I;ve seen other DM's just have one player roll a bluff check against another player and say you're scared you won't argue anymore. It's never worked right without constant Dm fiddling.

Everything in D&D is a bit clunky, but it works well enough for me an everyone I've ever played with over the years. 🤷‍♂️
 

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