D&D 5E What is the most powerful spell?

[Yaarel]

The two spell lists, ‘SRD Spells by Level’ and ‘All Official Spells by Level’, are now available in the Original Post.



Post 2 is now starting a new spell list called ‘Spells from Worst to Best’.

Here, all spells will rank compared to each other, regardless of their official level.

For example.

‘Flame Strike 5’ is officially a 5th-level spell. But it is comparable to ‘Fireball 3’ in the 3rd-level spells. They do the same amount of damage. The advantage of Fireball is, it covers a more useful area of effect. The advantage of Flame Strike is, it includes the radiant damage type that has less frequent resistance to it. Probably Fireball is a slightly more useful spell. Therefore, Flame Strike 5 will relocate to the position above Fireball 3, in the 3rd-level spell list. The official level of Flame Strike is 5th. But its defacto spell level, relative to other spells, is as if a 3rd-level spell.

Essentially, all red colored spells in the ‘Lower Level’ category will move to their relative positions among the lower level spells.

A new spell level is called ‘Minor Spells’, and is something like a ½-level spell, whose effect is less useful than a 1st-level spell slot. These minor spells may be redundant with what a skill check can do, or may be in need of a redesign, or so on.



This process of ranking all of the spells will take a number of days to complete. I am curious about the resulting list.

Ideally, every spell in the same relative level will be moreorless equally appealing choices.

 

[Yaarel]

[This post about ‘Communication Spells’ develops the assessment further and appears anew in a later post for more consideration.]

 

[Yaarel]

As mentioned in an earlier post, Reincarnate 5 is appealing and useful as a 1st-level spell, and for now lists as Not Bad.

 

[Yaarel]

Minor Spells
from the worst ... to the not-as-worst!

Skill Check
Indentify 1 − Short Rest
Legend Lore 5 − History
Find The Path 6 − Survival
Locate Animals Or Plants 2 − Survival
Detect Poison And Disease 1 − Medicine
Animal Friendship 1 − Animal Handling
Detect Thoughts 2 − Insight
Enthrall 2 − Persuasion/Intimidation/Bluff
Find Traps 2 − Perception/Investigation

Perhaps Skill Check
Speak With Dead 3 − perhaps Arcane/Religion
Feign Death 3ph − perhaps Medicine
Detect Evil And Good 1 − perhaps Arcane/Religion
Jump 1 − perhaps Athletics



The list of ‘Minor Spells’, includes spells whose effects seem rarely worth the price of a spell slot, and seem to benefit from a redesign. Think of Minor Spells as ½-Level spells. A redesign might be to delete it from the official spell list, or to make it more powerful to become an appealing choice among 1st-level spells, or to merge it as a feature of an other spell, or to move it into a separate design space such as make it a skill check rather than a spell, or so on.

The ‘Skill Check’ is now a category within ‘Minor Spells’. It lists the spells that do something that a skill check can already do. Many of these Skill Check spells are vestiges from early editions of D&D before the skill set evolved as a separate design space.

The ‘Perhaps Skill Check’ is a category of Minor Spells that a skill check might not be able to do because it might seem somewhat supernatural, but perhaps the relevant skill should be able to do it.



Find Traps 2 is arguably equivalent to a 1st-level spell, but seems so universally mocked and reviled that it is probably not even worth that. It lists as a Minor Spell.

The problematic with Find Traps 2 (Perception), Detect Thoughts 2 (Insight), Legend Lore 5 (History), and other less satisfactory spells, is they duplicate what a normal skill check can already do.

Therefore, if such a spell is too good, it makes the skill obsolete (which interferes with the concepts of nonmagical classes, like skillful Rogue or athletic Fighter). But oppositely, if the spell is insufficiently better than what a skill can already do, then the spell is a silly choice for a spell slot. The caster can already moreorless do it as a skill, or at least someone else in the team probably can. So why waste a spell on it?

All of these skill-mimicking spells end up as Minor Spells, rarely worth a spell slot and unable to compete alongside more useful 1st-level spells.



Humorously, the high level spell Find The Path 6 can only identify a path to a place whose location you already know. It almost seems like the spell is a spell published on April Fools Day as a prank. In any case, figuring out the way to a place that you know is normal navigating, and if naviation is difficult for some reason, figuring out the path is a normal feature of the Wisdom Survival skill check. Heh, as spells, even Find Traps seems more useful than Find The Path, and Find Traps is pretty terrible for a spell.

Locate Animals Or Plants 2 allows the caster to recognize if and where a certain kind of plant or animal is present in the area, within 5 miles. In other words, it is a Wisdom Survival skill check relating to tracking and knowledge of behavior and habitat.

Animal Friendship 1 is already something anyone can do with a Wisdom Animal Handling skill check. The fact that the spell Animal Friendship allows the beast a save against the friendship makes it even worse than a normal skill check.

The spell, Enthrall 2, is simply an attempt to distract someone. For example, keep a guard busy so that teammates can slip past him. Less usefully, the spell even grants the ‘mark’ a saving throw against the spell. The attempt to ‘distract’ someone is already something that any character can do, simply by making a social skill check. The method of distraction can be the Persuasion check to seduce the person, an Intimidation check to shock the guard verbally or even try start a fight, a Bluff check to fast talk or toss a stone in an other direction to create a distracting noise. A spell to do what a skill check can already do is superfluous and unnecessary.

Detect Poison and Disease 1 is pretty much what the Wisdom Medicine skill check should be able to do at-will.

Detect Evil And Good 1 is really a ‘detect planar creature’ spell, specifically an Elemental, Fey, Celestial, Fiend, Undead, or Aberration. This is a Minor Spell that is less satisfactory as a choice among 1st-level spells. Perhaps the capability to detect these ‘otherworldly spirits’ works best as a simple Intelligence/Wisdom Arcane/Religion skill check. Or perhaps it can merge in as a feature of the Protection from Evil and Good spell. Thus the same spell the creates defenses for these otherworldly spirits also senses if any are present.

Identify 1 is unworth a spell because it is something that anyone can already automatically do during 15-minute short rest. Identifying the magical properties of a magic item is part of the process of attuning with it. But perhaps instead, this process works best if it requires a successful Intelligence Arcane skill check, for each property discovered and the attunement itself.



(Note. I agree with the school of thought that adds the skill proficiency bonus to any relevant ability check. Thus a Constitution Athletics skill check might apply to hold ones breath for a long time. An Intelligence Perception skill check effectively eliminates the needs for a separate Intelligence Investigation skill. And so on − whatever makes sense in a particular situation. But here in this thread, I am just listing the Ability that the Players Handbook associates with each skill.)

 

[Stalker0]

I think Heat Metal is actually undervalued as "Good", I think its Excellent.

The automatic damage is not to be discounted for a big bad in armor. Further, it can generate disadvantage on rolls, its an amazing spell, and one that can continue to be good at high levels if you don't have other uses for your bonus action.

 

[Yaarel]

I think Heat Metal is actually undervalued as "Good", I think its Excellent.

The automatic damage is not to be discounted for a big bad in armor. Further, it can generate disadvantage on rolls, its an amazing spell, and one that can continue to be good at high levels if you don't have other uses for your bonus action.

I can see that. I moved Heat Metal down into the Excellent category. Notably, Heat Metal is also one of the famous spells, like Invisibility.



Oppositely, I moved Moonbeam up into the Good category, across the cusp. It deals decent damage but requires an action to do so.

Probably, Heat Metal is better than Moonbeam. Heat Metal can deal 2d8 damage as auto-damage with successive bonus actions − and also inflicts a disadvantage or disarms a deadly item. Moonbeam can deal 2d10 damage but allows a save for half and requires successive actions.

Probably, the hype over Moonbeam is mostly from the misunderstanding about it. It seems genuinely a Good spell, in any case.

If anyone insists Moonbeam is Excellent, post your considerations about it.

 

[Yaarel]

Communication Spells
from the worst ... to the best!

Minor Spells
Detect Thoughts 2
Animal Messenger 2
Skywrite 2

0-Level Cantrips
Message 0

1st-Level Spells
Comprehend Languages 1

2nd-Level Spells
Sending 3
Telepathy 8
Telepathy Language mm
Tongues 3
Telepathic Bond 5



There are four related concepts.
• Sending 3
• Telepathy 8 the spell in the Players Handbook
• Telepathy Language mm described in the Monster Manual
• Tongues 3

All four seem appropriate for a 2nd level spell.

The first two spells enable communication with a remote creature that is ‘familar to you’. Sending 3 telepathically transmits upto 25 words into the mind of the creature, and allows a reply. The creature additionally can be in any plane, and comprehends the language if the language is unknown. Slightly better, Telepathy 8 transmits an ongoing conversation and also images, but doesnt reach other planes.

The second two spells enable two-way communication with nearby creatures. Tongues 3 mentally imbues nearby creatures with linguistic knowledge to understand each others languages, to communicate with each other. The Telepathy Language mm is not a spell but is an ability described in the Monster Manual. The Telepathy Language allows direct communication between the mind of the telepath with the minds of other creatures, one mind at a time. The Telepathy Language seems comparable to the Tongues 3 spell. Telepathy only communicates with one creature at a time, but the conversation is undetectable by other creatures. Tongues allows many creatures to communicate with each other at the same time. Both seem Not Bad for a 2nd-level spell slot, at most.



For comparison. The 1st-level spell, Comprehend Languages 1, enables one-way communication, with the comprehender able to understand speech and writing, but remaining unable to speak or write. Casting Comprehend Languages twice is about as effective as Tongues 3, thus comparable to a 2nd-level spell.

When a team encounters a creature that speaks an unknown language, or an inscription written in an unknown language, the DM can allow a relevant skill check to decipher its meaning, such as an Intelligence History skill check, or a Wisdom Insight check to discern the gist of what the creature seems to be saying. The spell, Comprehend Languages 1 is essentially an auto-success on a skill check to decipher a language.

As a skill check, the value of Comprehend Languages is of marginal usefulness as a spell, and perhaps belongs moreso in the Minor Spells. But for now, it lists as a Less Useful 1st-level spell. It is less useful because most sentient creatures speak Common and can easily communicate with each other, making the need to know an other language more situational.



Animal Messenger 2 and Skywrite 2 seem of less worth than a 2nd-level spell slot, and rank among Minor Spells. They enable communication with a remote person. It is doubtful Telepathy 8 and Sending 3 that similarly communicate with a remote person are worth a 2nd level spell slot, but perhaps they are, and for now, they rank as Not Bad 2nd-level spells.

Detect Thoughts 2 offers little more than a normal Wisdom Insight skill check. Arguably Insight can do everything that Detect Thoughts can, especially with regard to discerning the ‘emotional state’ of the creature. Unfortunately, Detect Thoughts grants the creature a Wisdom saving throw, making it less useful than a normal Insight skill check that requires a success. Detect Thoughts ranks as a Minor Spell and seems moreorless redundant with what the Insight skill can already do.

Message 0 is a Less Useful cantrip of marginal desirability. It too may belong better as Minor Spell. It ‘whispers’ a message that only a nearby target can hear, who is then able to discretely whisper back. Functionally, this cantrip is identical to mind-to-mind telepathic communication than no one else able to detect. Even at-will, telepathy may not even be worth a spell.



In sum, ‘telepathy’ in the senses of secretive communication, of understanding meaning across language barriers, of transmission of images, and of contacting remote persons − all of this together as a single spell cannot be worth more than a 2nd level spell slot. And seems only worth a cantrip at most, when permanent and at will.

While the flavor of telepathy is fun and is an important archetype, its actual mechanical value in the D&D gaming system is of negligible benefit.

 

[snickersnax]

I would like to point out a couple of things that you may not have considered with some spells:

"Give me 100 Azer slaves and I can forge an empire that would make the gods tremble" Arakses Al-Sakar Efreeti Pasha MM p 22

This is actually accomplish-able with conjure minor elemental, magic circle and planar binding at 8th level or higher. Even using conjure elemental, magic circle and planar binding at 7th level, a wizard could have an army of 30 or so earth elementals. As a set up situation this is incredibly powerful. Even a single elemental for a 24 hour adventuring day isn't bad by casting these three spells with planar binding at 5th level.

I know you are mostly thinking about spells that a wizard wants when he goes adventuring, but there are some spells that it is critical to have to prevent being adventured against. Leomund's Tiny is an excellent example, but spells like Modenkainen's Private Sanctum are essential the moment you start getting intelligent enemies that can hunt you down and kill you. Most DMs don't do this because it is so deadly to the PCs. There is a huge advantage in being the the attacker, and picking the timing of your attack. Scying and teleporting into an unprepared, resource-depleted party is a quick TPK. In my world by the time the characters are hitting level 7-9, spells like this and hallow aren't just excellent, they are essential.

As a side note, building a castle/dungeon/lair without liberal use of these spells is like not having a front door. Virtually all locations designed to have any security have these spells permanent.

 

[Yaarel]

@snickersnax

Yeah, this thread and the spell lists in the Original Posts are especially for the spells to choose for adventuring.

But note. Glyph Of Warding 3 positions as a 3rd-level Good Setup spell. It is potent because it can ‘store’ any spell of any level for an indefinite amount of time, that ‘triggers’ under whatever conditions the caster wants. The higher the spell slot used for Spell Glyph, the higher the spell that can be stored. The 1-hour casting prevents usage on the fly, but a thoughtful player might get some mileage out of it even while adventuring. The option for Explosive Rune seems less appealing, somewhere between 2nd-level and 3rd-level. But the Spell Glyph is impressive and perfect for customizing your own ‘lair defenses’ with whatever spells you want.



The way 5e is upto now, defenses for your ‘lair’ (castle, mage tower, wizard school, etcetera) and magic item creation are mixed in with the rest of the spell list. Spells like Continual Flame 2, Magic Weapon 2, Clone 8, and so on, feel like a kind of magic item creation. Along these lines are spells that do lair defense, like Hallow 5, Guards and Wards 6, even Alarm 1. For now, these are treated like other Setup spells. Their merit depends on their general desirability (Alarm is decent, Guards and Wards is a hot mess). As a rule that works often enough, the level of defense is roughly equal to the level of whatever it is defending against.

Note, I want to see ‘ethereality’ be available at the lowest tier (such as a 2nd level spell), and then a kind of lair-defense spell similar to Forbiddence 6, be also at 2nd level as a convenient way to deny ethereality or any other form of planar travel from entering into the defended space.

In Xanthars Guide, the Ranger Horizon Walker seems to have ethereality features, and I am curious if this happens in low levels. (Note, the 4e Shadar-Kai had phasing abilities to pass thru objects at level 1, and its design balances well.)

Satisfying mobility spells at the lowest tier, like Misty Step teleportation, makes me as a player happy. But I need convenient plausible way to deny such mobility so they dont spoil sensitive parts of the adventure, to make me as a DM happy. In other words, I need lair defenses at the lowest tier too.



With regard to spells to defend your lair, I am torn.

On the one hand, I like how free form the D&D approach to spell design is. The spell list is an eclectic repository of many different kinds of spells for many different kinds of purposes. This free form is great for creativity. The DM can invent new spells, pick and choose spells for a list that specializes for a specific purpose, like a thematic domain, or a function for a new class or so on. Players can pick and choose spells for a specific character concept, do spell research to invent a new spell (with DMs approval), and so on. The fluidity of the spell list is a nice feature of D&D.

On the other hand, I want to see magic item creation in a separate design space, and things like permanent lair defenses as part of that design space.

I treat all +1 mechanical bonuses as, by definition, ‘masterworks’. So for example, the reallife ‘damascus steel’ swords during the Medieval period would be magical in the sense of using the ‘magical’ properties that are inherent in special materials, but that require sophisticated technology and skill to benefit from. Given the culture, I would say, all samurai katana are by definition masterworks. In Japan metal was scarce and mainly wealthy sophisticated technologies made stuff out of it. So if it was metal, it was probably a masterwork too. Many (but not all) viking swords are masterworks, employing a sophisticated metallurgical blend of three metal bars treated three different ways, then forged together for flexibility, strength, and sharpness. And so on. Using dragon hide to make armor along with the proper technology and knowledge, can similarly produce +1 scale armor.

I am open to allowing a player character to create +1 ‘masterwork’ items, such as to become a famous sword smith. But only if that item is already an established central character concept.

Weapons like a +3 vorpal sword, are necessarily first +1 masterworks, that afterward underwent powerful enchantments. Items that have magical effects but lack a plus, are by definition non-masterworks that have been enchanted.

Something like that. I have allowed things on an ad-hoc adjudication, but havent decided on anything systematic for magic item creation.

It is easy to explain how a Wizard might be able to create a magic item, just make it a kind of spell research.

But I want to see the Fighter also function as a famous sword smith. Most legendary sword smiths were not especially known for other kinds of magic. So maybe make masterworks a kind of skill check?

Maybe, to make a +1 ‘masterwork’ weapon or armor, the character must

• be proficient with the item, and have already established it as a central character concept
• acquire the very expensive special materials to make the item
• dedicate sufficient downtime and equipment
• succeed on a Very Difficult or Nearly Impossible Intelligence (Athletics) (!) skill check

Maybe succeed on three successive skill checks, before accumulating three failures?

Some kind of separate design space for magic item creation generally, involving skill checks and special materials.



Likewise, I would treat lair defenses as permanent magic item creations, employing various relevant skills, special materials, and maybe similar spells depending on the defense. It might be necessary to add new skills. Maybe ‘Alchemy’ covers things like chemistry, metallurgy, stone masonry, and other examples of material sciences. Or maybe Arcana or Nature already includes these kinds of things.

 

[Yaarel]

Illumination Spells
from the worst ... to the best!

0-Level Cantrips

Less Useful
Produce Flame 0

Not Bad
Light 0
Dancing Lights 0

1st-Level Spells

Setup
−less useful
Daylight 3
Darkvision 2
−not bad
Continual Flame 2
−good
Fog Cloud 1
Darkness 2



Note, many spells radiate illumination. Compare, Flaming Sphere, Guiding Bolt, Faerie Fire, Lightning Arrow, and so on. However, the spells listed above create or negate illumination as their main effect. The Prestidigation-style cantrips are also absent from the list because they can only produce fire if an actual candle, torch, or campsite is already present, making their spark even less useful than that of a flint stone in a tinderbox that can ignite any kind of flammable material.

Illumination. The need for illumination generally happens when: one is in the wilderness at nighttime, inside a cave or similar underground ‘dungeon’, in a Human habitat but inside an uninhabited room or building, or one filled with sleepers at night, or in a Nonhuman habitat such as a Dwarf manor underground. The need for illumination happens often enough. But, it is easy and inexpensive to carry a torch, lantern, or candle. A torch can be dropped to illuminate from the ground to keep the hands free during combat. And so on.



Light 0 is Not Bad for a cantrip. It makes any object radiate an aura of light as a light source. The object can be upto 10-foot diameter, and its illumination extends across close range (20 foot radius) and is bright. One can even target an arrow to shoot it to illuminate a distant area. The ability to generate light at will, without occupying ones hand, even underwater, has situational value in combat or in long expeditions. The Light cantrip sets the standard for magical illumination in the 5e D&D gaming system.

Produce Flame 0 is comparable to Light 0, but Less Useful. The hand conjures a torch-like flame, at will. The description is ambiguous, but the 10-foot radius illumination seems to still burns if this hand also holds a sword or so on, since this flame wont burn oneself or ones own equipment. As a minor feature, the flame can also be thrown at a target to deal 1d8 fire damage, if that is useful for some situation. The use as a weapon seems less effective than other damage cantrips, and the use as illumination is not as effective as the Light cantrip. This is an other case where small fiddly abilities fail to add up to a more significant utility. Again, weapons such as arrows and light sources such as torches, are normally already present without wasting a cantrip slot.

(Perhaps it is better to fold the description of Produce Flame into one of the other fire-manipulating cantrips, as an additional feature, such as Control Flames, or Create Bonfire, or even Thaumaturgy, or Prestidigitation or Druidcraft.)

Create Bonfire 0ee fails to mention its illumination, but a ‘bonfire’ necessarily radiates quite a bit of light. Its main purpose is as a Less Useful attack spell to catch a hostile within it. Arguably, its bright light makes it more useful than Produce Flame, and its similar 1d8 damage does half damage on a failed save.

Dancing Lights 0 is comparable to Light 0, but probably slightly better. It creates four independent light sources at short range, thus can instantly illuminate distant hostiles without illuminating oneself. For amusing flavor its four auras of light can merge to form vague human-sized animate shapes.



The spell, Continual Flame 2, is less effective than a 2nd-level spell slot. There are already easy ways to generate illumination, when needed. The need for non-fiery light, such as underwater is situational. Moreover, the several cantrips that have this capability are permanent and at will. In other words, even ‘continual’ light is typically available. A situation is infrequent when a torch or a cantrip is unavailable, where it might become useful to spend a 2nd-level spell slot. And even if used as a Setup spell cast during down time, Continual Flame costs 50 gp to cast, the same price as a ten lanterns. If a character requires it, it might make more sense to hire an NPC to cast the spell on an object for the light source.

For the moment, the Continual Flame spell locates as a 1st-level Not Bad Setup spell, meant to be cast during downtime for an upcoming adventure, or simply to illuminate ones own ‘lair’. (Relative to other spells in the 1st-level list, I would probably rather have Continual Light 3 than Reincarnation 5, and would probably rather have Alarm 1 than Continual Light 3. Continual Light offers an effectiveness that seems on the cusp between Less Useful and Not Bad for a 1st-level Setup spell.)

As a 1st-level spell, one can still cast Continual Flame (or cast Daylight) by heightening its spell slot for it to a 3rd-level spell slot, in order to negate the Darkness 2 spell, according to the Darkness spell description.

Daylight 3 is yet an other method for generating illumination. It lasts 1 hour, and is not even continual. Its brightness extends to a short range radius (upto 60 feet). Cast it on an object to make the illumination mobile. Heh, cast it on a lantern to make a brighter lantern. For most situations, a lantern that illuminates for 6 hours is more useful than this 1 hour spell. Note, this socalled ‘daylight’ fails to qualify as ‘sunlight’ that might harm Drow, Undead, Oozes, or so on. The main purpose of the Daylight spell appears to be to negate magical Darkness. However, at 3rd-level, Dispel Magic is a Good spell that also does this among many other kinds of usefulness. In general, Daylight 3 feels more like a 1st-level spell that is Less Useful than Continual Flame 2. Perhaps it could be cast as a 1-hour Setup spell. It is difficult to imagine wasting an action to cast it during combat. Nevermind, it is painful to waste a spell slot for only 1 hour of illumination.

Even if it could be cast as a bonus action it might have been more useful during combat. As is, Daylight is a disappointing spell.

Darkness 2 blocks sight, even Darkvision, at short range, targeting a 15-foot radius for 10 minutes. Yet at 1st level, Fog Cloud 1 is probably a better spell, doing the same thing, but at twice the range, targeting a 20-foot radius for 1 hour. Moreover Fog Cloud negates even high level illumination spells. However, a wind of 10 miles or more disperses Fog Cloud, making it less useful outdoors if windy. Darkness can be cast on an unattended object to make the obscuration mobile. In other words, situationally Darkness is better.

It is easy to exit both Fog Cloud and Darkness with a single 30 foot move, making both situationally useful to require Setup.

Mainly, the spell will temporarily neutralize distant hostiles (archers and casters) while ‘focus firing’ on near hostiles.

Darkness and Fog Cloud blind the visibility of both allies and hostiles, making the benefits of its disadvantage a wash. It requires Setup to create a circumstance where hostiles can be contained in the obscuration, or allies can obviate it, or a temporary blinding of hostiles is circumstantially useful.

Both spells seem 1st level Good spells that require Setup to make worthwhile.

Darkvision 2 allows colorless vision in nonmagical darkness. It only benefits when in darkness and competes with the ease of illumination. But moreso the spell offers no benefit if any team mate lacks Darkvision thus requires illumination. The notable advantage of Darkness is highly situational: if all team members enjoy darkvision, and if the area is in total darkness, and if all hostiles lack darkvision, then it is functionally equivalent to Invisibility 2 versus those hostiles. Yet Invisibility itself is a 2nd-level spell that requires none of these significant situational prerequisties. In comparison, Darkvision is less powerful than Invisibility.

Darkvision seems a 1st-level Less Useful Setup spell, that is cast ahead of time for a situation that might benefit from operating in total darkness. The clue to its meriting 1st level, is the normalcy of Nonhuman races having Darkvision automatically at 1st level, as well as the spell itself having a duration for 8 hours, all without a hint of being too powerful. Note, most Nonhuman hostiles will also have darkvision thus negating any advantage against them. The fact that the spell description for Darkness requires concentration, makes the Darkness spell painfully inferior because casting it to see in darkness, effectively negates ones own ability to cast decent spells (that require concentration) for the next 8 hours.