D&D General Which was your favourite Forgotten Realms Cosmology?

[Vaalingrade]

My point had nothing to do whether it's overused, just to dispute the statement that it didn't exist before 2008. The Seelie Court as described on page 9 of the 2e Planescape product Planes of Chaos, is the definite precursor to the Feywild, already unmoored from a secure location in the Great Wheel in its wanderings, but not a full plane quite yet. It's very similar to how its sister plane slowly changed from the Demiplane of Shadow to the Shadowfell over the course of multiple editions.

Really depends on how much you regard the accidental prototypes to be genuine precursors to the final product.

The First World was an afterthought in the 3e MotP and in theory could be a pre-Feywild, but does that mean any ripoff 'Land of the Fey' was a direct precursor tot he Fey Wild?

And the plane of shadow was a sad emptyness filled with undead that existed there naturally despite being clearly described as being generated by a type of demise. It's... not really anything like the Shadowfell, which is more like Eberron's plane of shadow if it ate Ravenloft and also every Underworld.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

...and I would also say "the Shadowfell" did not exist before 2008, even though I know without doubt that precursor ideas did.

"The Feywild" and "the Shadowfell" refer to those specific instances. If one means generic fairy-anything or shadow-anything, it is both clearer and more accurate to use generic terms.

They had their names changed, that all. If I change my name to Fall Parker I don't become a different person.

 

[Alzrius]

"The Feywild" and "the Shadowfell" refer to those specific instances. If one means generic fairy-anything or shadow-anything, it is both clearer and more accurate to use generic terms.

Sometimes attaching a particular term to something makes it less palatable. For instance, the Shadowfell's underdark, which was called the Shadowdark:

 

[EzekielRaiden]

They had their names changed, that all. If I change my name to Fall Parker I don't become a different person.

Certainly, I agree you don't. I disagree that this was merely a name change. The Shadowfell is not simply 1:1 identical with the Plane of Shadow with a different name. It blends together elements of the Plane of Shadow, the Negative Energy Plane, the Domains of Dread, and even some influences like whatever plane Kelemvor rules over in FR. Likewise, the Feywild is not simply "totally generic Annwn clone."

Sometimes attaching a particular term to something makes it less palatable. For instance, the Shadowfell's underdark, which was called the Shadowdark:

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That's the fault of giving a name to the under-earth realm of each place and trying to be cutesy with it. Both "Shadowdark" and "Feydark" sound stupid because they are stupid, coming from dull grid-filling rather than actual cosmology. But that need not reflect on those two things themselves--nor have any bearing on the statement given, which was not that the name was bad, but that "the Feywild" was overused.

Which has since been clarified to actually mean "PC races were classified as fey for reasons the poster disliked, and thus that means the Feywild had been overused." A position I still disagree with, but at least it has a perfectly reasonable logic to it.

 

[DarkCrisis]

Sometimes attaching a particular term to something makes it less palatable. For instance, the Shadowfell's underdark, which was called the Shadowdark:

View attachment 360905

So that’s where Kelsey got it

 

[Voadam]

I really like the 4e cosmology as its own thing, but my FR knowledge is mostly AD&D with a touch of 3e so I am familiar with the FR Great Wheel stuff and not with the Tree or FR axis stuff and so FR Great Wheel cosmology feels FR to me.

Lolth is in the outer plane of the Abyss. Bane has his relationship with the Devils. The FR AD&D campaign settings and the god books and the early Dragon article on the pantheon work for me as FR.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

The Shadowfell is not simply 1:1 identical with the Plane of Shadow

There was never any singular version of the Plane of Shadow.

It blends together elements of the Plane of Shadow, the Negative Energy Plane,

Because they represent overlapping concepts that were never very distinct.

Likewise, the Feywild is not simply "totally generic Annwn clone."

Yawhat clone? D&D has had many different versions of fairyland, the Feywild just consolidates them. For example there is Beyond the Crystal Cave, which in the new version is set in the Feywild, without needing to change anything.

 

[QuentinGeorge]

This has happened to like, what, 3-4 types of creatures? Elves, Goblinoids, and Changelings? That’s it, right? I think it makes sense for all of them to be connected to Fey in D&D, they were in folklore. There have been a few new fey races (Fairies, Harengon), but most 5e races and monsters have no connection to the Feywild. IMO, it’s mostly just making up for the lack of fey in earlier D&D.

And as I said earlier, Fey is one of the most uncommon creature types in 5e.

Yes, I've heard the old "goblins are fey in folklore so it totally makes sense". It's bogus. though.

Goblins might be akin to faerie creatures in folklore, but D&D goblins are most decidedly not "folklore" goblins. They are very clearly almost entirely cribbed from the work of Tolkien, an author who doesn't assign any "fey" connection to his creations. D&D even maintains Tolkien's "mistake" (as stated by himself) of hobgoblins being bigger, stronger goblins. Suddenly assigning them an inherent "fey-ness" goes completely against how they are portrayed in all of D&D's history (including 5e) and strikes me as another of the eye-rollingly daft decisions of the design team under Crawford's tenure. You might as well give snake hair and a tail to D&D gorgons.

 

[QuentinGeorge]

Sounds more like you have a problem with execution then concept.

Both execution and concept are ridiculous and trite. Sort of a "form and meaning reach ultimate communion" situation.

 

[Shardstone]

Both execution and concept are ridiculous and trite. Sort of a "form and meaning reach ultimate communion" situation.

I'm sure your tastes are only the highest quality arts, of course.