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Year of The Zombie...What do people think?

PJ-Mason

First Post
Well, i just finished reading it. Though i didn't thoroughly imprint the rules part into my brain (i tend to gloss over rules until i really need them).

I like it a lot.

Style of writing is nice and clean. I thought that the "After the Risen" conclusions were logical. Being a fan of zombie, and apocalyptic themes even more so, most of it was familiar to me. But you did manage to come up with some thoughts and scenarios i hadn't thought of. I enjoyed that.

The insanity section was a nice touch. I liked Becka's journals, even if i think she developed a serious "casual killer syndrome" of her own! YOTZ is as much a study of human nature as it is the zombie genre.

I would consider YOTZ to be necessary primer for anyone who wants to run a well prepared D20 Zombie game. Anyone interested in useful apocalyptic themes and game material can also find this book quite useful.
 

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Roudi

First Post
PJ-Mason said:
YOTZ is as much a study of human nature as it is the zombie genre.

Hell yes! This is something that came up a lot in the playtest. So often our party was tested: would we cling to our morals, compassion, and desire to do the right thing, or would we do what was necessary to survive? We could not often do both.

I will admit my bias up front as well. I played a small part in the YotZ playtest (my character, Tenskwatawa, even appears once in the flavour text), and I did some miscellaneous work for the book. Not only do I think YotZ is a great zombie game; I think it's a great game, period. Tim (Ralts) spent a hell of a lot of time working on YotZ, over the space of (I think) two years. When we playtested YotZ, I could tell already it was a great game, but I wasn't sure if everyone would agree. Now, with all the positive feedback the book has received, I'm convinced that every hour Tim spent making this masterpiece was worth it.
 

Ymdar

Explorer
Does this game actually modify any of the base d20 modern rules or does it only provide new feats and/or advanced classes (as well as monsters etc.)?
 
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PJ-Mason

First Post
Ymdar said:
Does this game actually modify any of the base d20 modern rules or does it only provide new feats and/or advanced classes (as well as monsters etc.)?

It does add some rules, like the Feral Child class (damn dirty little brats!!) and a couple advanced/pretisge classes. It has zombie templates and insanity rules. It also has a massive list of stat blocks for different military types, cops, raiders, etc. Extensive. It has some stats for RPO's blood and Guts version of D20 modern, but they also put in stock D20 modern stats for those as well.
 

Kesh

First Post
I've heard a few folks state that it spends a little too much time on the... uses... of women in a post-apocalyptic society. It's one reason I'm hesitant to pick up the book.

What do those of you with the book see in there?
 

ukgpublishing

First Post
Kesh said:
I've heard a few folks state that it spends a little too much time on the... uses... of women in a post-apocalyptic society. It's one reason I'm hesitant to pick up the book.

What do those of you with the book see in there?

I'd have to say that if you can find a page and a half of complete text concerning the... uses... of women in a post-apocalyptic society, in the entire 154 pages I would be very surprised. Where such aspects are discussed they are not graphic, and are more in the line of a study of human nature than an excuse for overly sexual reference.

However, I ought to let someone who has bought the book and is considered less biased than myself answer this one as well :D

Cid
 

Ralts Bloodthorne

First Post
Kesh said:
I've heard a few folks state that it spends a little too much time on the... uses... of women in a post-apocalyptic society. It's one reason I'm hesitant to pick up the book.

What do those of you with the book see in there?
I looked it over again, with that in mind, and found a few examples of what you are talking about.

In the flavor text, a woman offers oral favors in return for food, but is turned down and told that she can join if she will fight to protect everyone and join the group.

Flavor Text said:
“Where are you from?” Buck asked bluntly, his hard, implacable gaze boring into the naked people who were just now putting back on their clothing. True to form, we hadn’t screwed around, ordering them to lay down their weapons and strip naked before we’d even unmask or show ourselves. I sat in the turret of Bradley-Three, ready to hose them down with the 20mm if they even farted wrong.
“Yreka. We finally left about three weeks ago when we ran out of food. We managed to get a semi out past the deaders. We ran out of food and water, we didn’t have no choice.” A guy told us, pulling his shirt on over his head. I noticed that his clothing was his first worry, his hunting rifle still laid in the dirt where he’d dropped it. Idiot. He was meat for the grinder unless he learned to worry about his weapon first. Out of habit, my fingers searched out the butt of my pistol, as if to reassure themselves it was there.
“How bad is it?” Buck questioned, standing up in the vehicle commander’s hatch of Bradley-One. His hands were on the M-249, but it was not aimed anywhere in particular, but I knew he could swing it into the small group of people in less time than it would take them to scream.
“There’s no food, no water, and deaders everywhere.” A woman said. “We’re really hungry. Do you have any food?”
“None we can spare.” Buck lied. Bradley-Five carried only a driver, co-driver, gunner, and buttload of MRE cases. Bradley-Seven was loaded with what Greg and Buck called “A-Rats”, metal sealed meals that only needed to be dropped into boiling water to heat. Below me, Zhakov hushed Emily, putting the pacifier into her mouth to stop her crying in frustration that she could not get her foot into her mouth.
“I’ll perform oral sex for some food.” Another woman said, hunger and desperation plain in her voice.
“Forget it, lady. We don’t have enough to share.” Buck answered. Then his mumbled voice came over the tac-com. “Probably edited out just to fill her stomach.” I heard Sam’s harsh laugh, and I couldn’t help but smile. Buck went back to speaking to the crowd: “That’s why we asked about Yreka. If it’s as bad as you say, then we’ll have to bypass it.”
“All of those vehicles, and you don’t have enough food to share? You’re soldiers, you’re supposed to protect us!” one young man shouted. Hunger had not managed to take the softness out of his face, and I realized with a surprise that he was about my age. Chronologically, perhaps, but not in mileage. This was a face that had never fought to survive, to improve a situation. It was a face that others had protected, and that had hidden from the Risers. I hated that face the moment I saw it.
“Who the beep said we were soldiers, idiot? In case you didn’t notice, the military got eaten on order from his Holiness the President as he ran off into a hole. If we were soldiers, why would we protect the same people who shot at us a few months ago?” Buck asked. He dropped back into the hatch. “We have enough room to take you with us, if you want. You can hook up with us, fight with us, and share what we have with us, but we don’t have enough to give away.”
“And the deaders?” One woman asked.
“We kill them.” Buck answered simply. “Are you with us or not.”
“Aw, bleep, I’m in.” The woman who had offered oral sex for food said, holding her hands out to her side and walking toward the Bradley Buck was on. Buck popped back out of the hatch and pointed them at Bradley-Two rather than his.
“It’s murder, Carol. You know what the news said, killing the deaders is still murder.” Another man said, as he turned to Buck. “You have to share with us, we’re people.”
Buck watched roughly half of the twelve people climb into the back of Bradley-Two, reacting to Sam opening the dismount hatch and waving to them. One woman burst into tears at the sight of safety, weaponry, and stacked ammunition.
Buck almost grinned, the burn scars turning his face into a sneer. “We’ve got to do two things, buddy, Jack and bleep, and in case you hadn’t noticed, Jack left town, got dead, and got back up, so he can go to hell, too. You ain’t gettin’ nothing from us for free. Bradley-One to all vehicles, let’s pull out.” He ordered, and the vehicles lurched forward. The rest of them began cursing us, and there was a dull clunk as a rock struck the back of the vehicle I was in.
We never saw them again, once we turned the corner and left them behind.-From the Diaries of Becka

The trade value of sexual services is listed, as well as prostitution adjustments, but this is maybe a few paragraphs at the most, and a few listings on the trade goods table, but that's a part of post apacolypse life, as it's a renewable resource/coin and would be in high demand.

I'm not sure what your definition of "too much time" as far as the book might go, but feel free to explain your concerns.

There's no sex scenes, although it does mention that slavers keep an eye out for tradable women, that some people are willing to trade sex for such things as ammunition/food/water, but I thought I pretty much handled it in an adult manner.

The following is the flavor text of the bartering/trading section (cleaned up for Granny Rules) supposedly written by one of the iconics. It's been *slightly* cleaned up to make it granny worth, but I'll bold where I cleaned it.

OK, Meatsacks, listen up. You might have strolled down the block with a couple C-notes in your wallet before the Rising, but now, those notes ain’t nuthin’ but pretty butt-wipe. Credit Cards? Use ‘em to shim the weapon tripod or something along those lines. The old world is dead, most of it is staggering around looking to take a bite out of your yuppy butt, so all of your sharp dealing won’t matter when Mr. Hungry takes a bite out of you.

You need to get it through your head. Money. Is. Worthless. Now. If you have something I want, and bargain too hard, I may just decide to kill you for it. You have to have something I want, and I have to have something you want, and we’ve got to trust each other enough to make a trade.

The main things that are going to be of the most worth will be guns, ammo, food, and sexual favors. Hate to tell you this, but homophobia is a thing of the past, most Traders don’t care if you’re male or female, they’ll hump either, and they’ll take oral sex from a goat if it feels good and they can get it cheaply enough. Services work too, if you have a skill that someone else needs. That’s why gunsmiths are virtually untouchable - nobody attacks a gunsmith. Bridge-Keepers and Ferrymen are also well-paying services, getting as much as 2 cans of beef stew and a clip of 9 mm ammunition per person.

When stopping at a barter community, things need to be looked at before trades can begin: how “rich” is the community, how big they are, what their room for expansion is, and if they are a colony or just a waystop. You should also take a look at their defenses. Often assisting in reworking their defenses against both Risers and raiders can be worth a warm bed and a willing body, as well as all you can stuff into your gut. If you can, see how they treat other Traders, so you know if they are trustworthy.

When trading ammo,one needs to think about how common the ammo is. Regular rounds will not be worth as much as special rounds, and common calibers are worth far more than the exotic calibers. Anti-personnel landmines are very valuable, as is the odd flamethrower or two you may come across. Heavy ammunition for military crew-served weapons can bring a premium, but only if the community possesses those weapons.

Types of ammo that can be traded are bullets, grenades, rockets, mines, etc., but never discount such things as high-quality cross-head hunting arrows, bowstrings, crossbow quarrels, or even paintballs and CO2 cartridges. Many communities have been known to use frozen paintballs on Risers, since a well-aimed burst from a high-quality paintball gun can kill a Riser.

Sex always works. For one thing, what a woman has is a renewable resource that doesn’t normally go bad… with a bit of precaution. Some communities are hard up enough for sex that it is not uncommon for a Riser to be bound to a table and used sexually by those who either don’t care, or are excited by such a prospect. Those communities will pay premium for sex, but on the bad side, they might decide to hold you prisoner and take what they want from you.

When trading sexual favors one has to look at what is desired. If you are an unscrupulous type and have no morals, (pre) adolescent children will be worth more to some of the more unsavory elements, especially if they are virgins, both male and female. Fleshmongers of this sort are looked down upon by nearly everyone, including many Slaver bands, and it’s almost an unwritten law that sooner or later, someone is going to kill you. If my friends and I catch you, you can bet it’s going to be hard. We’ve got a nailgun with your name on it, scumbag.

If it is just a trading outpost and you just want a tumble, most women are willing to trade ammo for oral sex. When going for a deeper, more intimate encounter, more must be traded, as the act, and length of time, with the women increases. This, too, will also depend on the women. If the woman is just horny and just wants to provide sex, the price will be lower than, say, for a woman of skill and apparent class. If a woman is good at what she does and has a reputation as such she will be sought out for her skills, and thus a higher price will be paid, and it will not necessarily be ammo or weapons - food, brass casings, gunpowder, gun oil, clothing, water, etc. can also be exchanged for sexual favors. Same goes for men in the profession.

Skill counts more than just looks and willingness. Everyone out there has at least one hole to poke it into, and if you are really desperate, there are always the Risers to get your jollies off on. Someone who is good at sex can nearly name their own price. Make no mistake, however, that looks do have a major affect upon the price.

If you find a settlement looking to expand their DNA pool, women and men who are virile and strong will be sought after more than someone who is sick or weak. Drifter colonies looking for new brides or men to bring into the fold will have the same outlook upon the deal. The wider the spread in the gene pool, the better the chances for building a healthy, stable, civilization again. It is not uncommon for Drifter Packs to pay strong, healthy men in food or ammunition to impregnate certain women within their group for a healthy baby.

Everything will have a price, and the price will vary from location to location and availability of the items. The further away from a town or city that is easily scavenged, the more highly priced and valued things will become. Items such as food, ammo, weapons, generators, gasoline, oil, hydraulic fluid, water purification systems, and blankets will catch a premium. The lesser items such as clothing, shoes, fiction books and possibly untested water might not be in high demand, but there may still be a market.

As always, medical equipment will garner the highest price of anything out there, including gasoline and weapons. A few vials of penicillin or especially morphine could get the trader a brand-new M-4 assault rifle and ten clips of 5.56 ammunition, even if the Trader doling out the medical supplies was so drunk he couldn’t stand.

Gardening will only be prevalent in well-guarded and -fortified areas, so fresh fruits and vegetables will be considered a delicacy and sought after, as will staples such as rice and flour. Fresh meat, eggs, and dairy products could be extremely hard to come by as most of the cattle, while unmolested by the Risers, still seem to have a large following of deaders for some reason yet unknown. Getting close enough to a herd of cattle to get a nice juicy steak without becoming a nice juicy meal for a deader is tough.

Tools, building supplies, metals such as lead, iron, and copper, cooking utensils, pots and pans, rope, yarn, twine, wire, and condoms will be other items of value. Textiles such as raw wool, hemp, or handmade fabrics will also be hard to come by, as will women’s sanitary items, paper, writing utensils, or gathered foods are highly prized.

When trading weapons, the type of weapon and whether or not it is loaded and with what will come into play. A shotgun is worth a lot more than a G-11 assault rifle, since repairs and reloading are much easier for the shotgun. Knives always sell well. Surprisingly, replicas of medieval swords, axes, and maces sell particularly well.

Types of weapons that can be traded are pistols, rifles, shotguns, rocket launchers, military grade weapons, civilian weapons, knives, and swords. This all depends, of course, on the care that was taken with the weapons. A rusty uncared-for blade or gun will have a lower value as it is less likely to work or more likely to break easily,whereas a well-cared-for weapon will get a higher price in trade goods.

Starting to understand? Good.

Good luck, sucker, and don’t try to rip anyone off with more firepower than you.
--Buck

And...

Two entries on the trade table. Nothing major.


I provided the above so you could make your own decision to decide what you wanted to do. But, I figure I will provide my rational for putting such in.

In post apacolypic fiction such as Deathlands, Survivor, Ashes, etc, sex is often listed as a barter (Read "Seedling" by David Axler, part of the Deathlands series for a graphic and blatant example) resource, and in the words of one person in one of the books: "A few hours [of sex] is worth a few days of eating in the joy-house."

There's also been plenty of PA fiction where the heroes were lured into an ambush by a town supposedly interested in expanding it's gene pool (using the heroes) but in reality after food and trade goods by killing the heroes.

It's not the predominate theme behind it, and I did my best not to denigrate/devalue women, or treat them like objects. While the main "speaker" of the flavor text is female, she's not just the group's baby-machine. She's tough, strong, pulls her own weight, and is just as important as everyone else. The other lead female, Sylvia, hardly seems sexual at all, but rather an amoral killing machine, but that's just her, from the way she was portrayed in the playtesting.

If you have any questions, feel free to go ahead and ask.
 
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Wolv0rine

First Post
Could be worse, the tertiary Iconic female (Cindy) doesn't get much play-time in the book's flavor text. But she was smart enough in the playtest to notice Buck (another Iconic, the author of that flavor text Ralts quoted in his post there, as a matter of fact) was essentially a walking shield of semi-flameproof beef, and decided the safest place to be was oftentimes behind or under him. A practical gal, she was.

She also tended to be the one that assured that the group had something to eat, but that doesn't address the current topic. :)
 

Ralts Bloodthorne

First Post
In the Wolf Pack sections, it does describe the horrible fate of girls who have gotten too old, or pregnant woman captured by the pack, but this fits more in the ecology of the Wolf Pack rather than gratutious. It helps underscore the brutal, almost animalistic life of a Wolf Pack member. It shows that they are barely human, and not even civilized by the slightest veneer of socially acceptable behavior.

While I admit that it may disturb some people, that is why the mature rating was added, and why I recommend it for mature audiences only and warn about the graphic horror and brutality in the setting.

I can assure you, however, that the iconic voice, who is female, is not one who stands there and screams while the males do all the work. Nor is she weak and frail. While it is correct that she eventually developes a bad case of "Casual Killer Syndrome" it isn't from any weakness on her part, and she doesn't lose her humanity.

I was VERY careful in my portrayal of women in that product, and just for the record, with the exception of the Wolf Packs, you could replace female with male in much of the places that speak of sex. The woman in the flavor text above could very well have been male, and in one playtest was.

I hope all of that helps in your decision. Trust me, I won't take any offense if you decide it's just not your thing.
 
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PJ-Mason

First Post
I think you'd have to be very touchy about the subject to take offense at what little was written about rape, sex, or sex-for-trade in the book. It was handled logical and not in any kind of detail. The few times its mentioned, is in passing.
 

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