John Wick Presents Lays Off 7th Sea Staff

A couple of years ago, John Wick's 7th Sea 2nd Edition smashed tabletop RPG Kickstarter records by raising a phenomenal $1.3M - a record which has only been surpassed once since, by Matt Colville's $2.1M Strongholds & Streaming. Unfortunately, it seems that the company is running into financial difficulties.


The company had some sad news to share in a Kickstarter update to backers yesterday. John Wick Presents has just laid off all of its employees. Wick himself says that this will not prevent the rest of the line being released, but that it will slow down. He's trying to bring on board other companies to help with printing, board game production, and fulfilling his 7th Sea obligations.

"After reviewing the company finances in August, I discovered JWP was not making enough to sustain its current work force. And so, in the ugliest and hardest day of my life, I had to lay off all the JWP employees.

What this means is the 7th Sea lines are going to slow down. I cannot maintain the release schedule we promised before GenCon. That doesn’t mean books aren’t going to happen, it just means they’re going to be slower than expected."


The campaign has delivered plenty of rewards already (I'm a backer myself and received my core rulebook long, long ago). The core rulebook released on time, and various stretch goals have been met, with updated production schedules announced monthly -- the latest production schedule was announced in August (the company posts one each month to keep backers updated), but Wick says that that schedule cannot be maintained now. So far 7 of 12 sourcebooks have been released.

A second Kickstarter, 7th Sea: Khitai was launched last year, which raised $200K. The latest update on that Kickstarter doesn't delve into any of the company's problems, but does say:

"I’ve been talking to various companies about partnering with JWP to continue printing 7th Sea as well as expanding it into territories JWP couldn’t. We tried doing board games (twice) and both times failed. Another company, with a stronger reputation for making board games, could make War of the Cross fly in a way I couldn’t. That’s why I’ve been talking to other publishers about partnering up to fulfill our 7th Sea obligations.For Khitai, I anticipate a May-June release. This may be sooner depending on a lot of factors. As soon as those projects are done, I can let you know where everything else stands. I'll have a better idea of the entire release schedule once negotiations are done with our potential publishing partners.

2018 has been an awful year for everyone, myself included. Let's hope for a better 2019."


The company cancelled its War of the Cross boardgame Kickstarter back in August.

John Wick Presents has done a good job of keeping backers updated. While unfortunate for the employees who were laid off, it only points to a slowed release schedule rather than a full stop.

It's not the first report of financial speedbumps at RPG companies recently. Last month, Evil Hat Productions announced a scaling back of the 2019 publication schedule, and some departing employees.
 

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Grimkrieg

Villager
I'm not really surprised. I own the new 7th Sea I can run the game perfectly from the first book and the supplements mostly contain world information and advice instead of useful game tools like adventures or monsters. The next books were of little interest to me because of that. I just don't see how producing a storygame with the splatbook model of a more rules and options intensive game like the old 7th Sea was going to work.

Hopefully, everyone lands on their feet, and Jon Wick finds a way to satisfy all of the backers.
 

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Before all the long knives get drawn, keep in mind that WOTC has a track record for laying off a lot of folks once a product is mature and many of the promised books are out the door. There are a few threads on this forum discussing past WOTC Christmas layoffs. Once a product is mostly complete, produced and shipping, the harsh truth is you either need a new product line to keep folks busy or you don't need the folks.

Sounds like this KS got most of the stuff out the door and into backers hands before the layoffs hit.

That's why you should hire people on a contract basis for the project. Hiring people and then laying them off isn't necessary.
 

Broccli_Head

Explorer
Agree

On one hand its sad for the staff and also I generally like the idea of Age of Sail era RPGs. But the 7th sea names are simply too cringe worthy for me to actually consider it.

I liked the system, but the non-earth names for clear Earth analogs drives me crazy.
 



the Jester

Legend

Thanks.

Ugh.

I'm sorry, but John Wick is full of BS on this. I know it's all the rage in some circles to bash ToH as completely unfair, but it isn't. I'm a hardcore, no-mercy, high-lethality DM, and I have run ToH and seen the entire party make it through successfully. It takes caution to do so, but it's absolutely possible. And John Wick horribly misrepresents it.

The Alexandrian's counterpoint to it covers the bases, but Wick's experience with it sounds like he basically made a point to screw over his players. Sheesh. I run hard and mean games, but strive to be fair, and I think ToH is one of the greatest adventures ever- and one that is extremely difficult. But fair. Unless the DM intentionally screws you over.
 


The Monster

Explorer
Wick shows up at my local con every year (I live in the same state as he does), and he's an odd duck: friendly enough, but also very strident in his views and seems to take pleasure in rubbing people the wrong way if they disagree with him. He's quite certain that he's right all the time, or at least that's how he comes across. I found his comment about how "awful" 2018 was for everyone strange, too - because he seems to imply the gaming industry. If so, he's way off, although there are some smaller companies, like Evil Hat, that have struggled (due to their own mistakes, in that latter case).
This is pretty much my impression from reading Wick's stuff (mostly games, but a few articles and such). I (and my group) loved 7th Sea 1 (though even then I wanted to metaphorically slap Wick silly for his irrational hatred of maps!); we're running 7th Sea 2, and it's fun. But I almost regret backing the Kickstarter. It was so big - and JW has delivered practically every bit of what was advertised already - that I can't help but wonder if it hasn't overfed the tendency of many authors and artists to listen to their own egos. Our group has certainly come across some significant issues with the 7S2 rules ; there's lots of interesting ideas; but from the core rules and ever more so with the nation splatbooks, I've had the feeling that it was kind of phoned in, a vague odor of "I'm a genius, you'll love this, and you have to fill in the gaps yourself." I didn't back the boardgame because it just didn't look interesting. At all. It apparently had exactly one mechanic with some flavor around it, and if I wanted a game like the one they pitched, I'd pull out the old classic Diplomacy (which, for the record, I never really liked).
I wish them all well, and hope they all learn some good lessons from the experience (both from working together and from being part of a project shutdown). But I will continue viewing anything with Wick's name on it with an ever-more skeptical eye.
 

Valdier

Explorer
Eh, I've known Wick for 15+ years and he has tolerate/dislike relationship amongst most of the gaming community around here. It's a rare person that genuinely says "I enjoy playing anything with him" in my personal experiences. As mentioned previously, he has very strong "I'm always right" stances, on pretty much everything. I'm honestly not surprised, based on past interactions that the money/finances were mismanaged. It's not his first rodeo in which things were not delivered to people.

When things don't go his way, he tends to react in semi-extreme all or nothing ways (again, in my experience). This isn't unexpected from me at least.

Also, 2018 has been a gangbuster year for most. #outoftouchmuch?
 


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