Is it just me or is the spell Rope Trick kind of absurd?

FrogReaver · Jan 2, 2019

UngeheuerLich said:
i think, a rope ladder would qualify as the up to 60 ft long rope. Yes, is not fully perpendicular to the ground, but nothing says, that all knots are loosened. So it is up to the DM.
As time is concerned: Everyone arguing about a few seconds of an hour in this spell or others will be dropped out of my group for sure. It would be absurd if a castng time would be given as An hour and 1 minute.

I am just reminded to the joke:

"The teacher shows a coin and tells the students, that it is 200 years old. Next day she asks how old the coin is. One student raises his hand and says: 200 years and a day."

It also doesn’t say the rope isnt poisoned and anyone touching it doesn’t immediately dies...

iserith · Jan 2, 2019

FrogReaver said:
It also doesn’t say the rope isnt poisoned and anyone touching it doesn’t immediately dies...

That must be the "trick" part of the spell.

Leatherhead · Jan 2, 2019

I can assure you, it isn't just you.

It's a legacy spell, but the legacy of the spell is different than how the spell is being used currently: In 2nd edition, it had a duration measured in turns. In 3rd edition, it was measured in hours, but you couldn't' really rest in it until you were level 8 (and presumably couldn't even then, because your party had some kind of extra-dimensional storage like a handy haversack). It was meant to be an alternate invisibility spell first and foremost. Using it to rest is iffy to begin with, and the less ambiguous safe resting spells (Catnap and Leomund’s Tiny Hut) are an entire level above it.

Supergyro · Jan 2, 2019

I would most caster would need to do the 1' rope thing since, well, rope climbing 60' is not a trivial task.

I remember knocking myself out ropeclimbing in elementary school, I was a spider monkey then in comparison to my current adult physique, and only 15' was enough to leave my arms nothing but painful sticks of agony rubber.

Krachek · Jan 2, 2019

Why using theological reasoning when a DM can just banish a spell or two.
Assume your setting choice, if you don’t want short or long rest in dungeon just assume it.

Iry · Jan 2, 2019

IF casting the spell counts as strenuous activity, the rest of the party can start resting before your spell is actually cast. Their short rest finishes before you depart the rope trick. Assuming you don't get attacked 6 seconds after getting out of the rope (which is possible), your short rest finishes.

If there is any contention about climbing the rope, just use 0 feet of rope. There are not many situations where you absolutely need lots of rope distance.

MarkB · Jan 2, 2019

thorgrit said:
2. "up to" is the key phrase here. If your wizard pulls out the tangle of 50' rope to use for this spell, instead of a short section, you can just slap them. By reading the spell, 60' is the maximum length, there's no listed minimum, so you could theoretically hold a 1' section somewhere around waist- to chest-high, and just duck a bit to climb in, not even using the rope at all.

On the other hand, the "up to 60 feet" does give the spell a handy secondary use as a poor man's Levitate if you need to reach a spot on a high ceiling.

Mort said:
And because it's now been in every edition since (though I don't think it made it into 4th?) It's now achieved legacy status and here we are.

4e had what I felt was a much neater solution, one that was much favoured by our group at the time. I don't recall the exact name of the item, but it was a magic dagger that allowed you to carve a doorway into a wall, then open it and step through into an extradimensional space just large enough to accommodate a reasonably-sized party. Once closed from the inside, the door was invisible, and the room would last for eight hours. The dagger was usable once per day.

Also, 4e's short rests were much shorter (10 minutes?), so there wasn't much call to make special arrangements for them - even if you were interrupted, it wouldn't take up much of your working day.

GMforPowergamers · Jan 3, 2019

iserith said:
Why are they "frantically climbing" and "often failing?" Climbing is a factor of speed and ability checks are called for only in certain circumstances such as the climbing surface being slippery or having few handholds. I don't think a rope qualifies here on that basis.

I am going to assume you never had to deal with a grade school gym class then... because I can even today lift and carry 100+lbs (and have had to) but I can't climb a rope...I could not at 8 or 15, and now at more then double that still can't... anyone even with a 16 str (lets just assume the whole party doesn't have 16+str) has a hard time doing it under the best of conditions...and if someone has an 11 or less (god forbid the 8) it should be almost impossible.

Gladius Legis said:
A couple of people in that *other thread* tried to make the case that climbing the rope into the space is "more strenuous" than what is allowed for a short rest, which I just do not buy. If the climb required an Athletics check, that'd be one thing, but it doesn't, so AFAIC it's no more strenuous than walking around your campsite or house.

LOL...omg you think climbing a rope is as easy as walking down a hall... again I ask, did you not have rope climb torture in grade and middle school???

Now I don't think I would assign a super high DC to climb it...but let me look at climb DCs in book...

and I can't find any...so I guess climbing both is and isn't an athletics check... So I will go by my own experience here and say you can't climb a rope untrained, but trained it is a DC 10ish

GMforPowergamers · Jan 3, 2019

MarkB said:
On the other hand, the "up to 60 feet" does give the spell a handy secondary use as a poor man's Levitate if you need to reach a spot on a high ceiling.

4e had what I felt was a much neater solution, one that was much favoured by our group at the time. I don't recall the exact name of the item, but it was a magic dagger that allowed you to carve a doorway into a wall, then open it and step through into an extradimensional space just large enough to accommodate a reasonably-sized party. Once closed from the inside, the door was invisible, and the room would last for eight hours. The dagger was usable once per day.

Also, 4e's short rests were much shorter (10 minutes?), so there wasn't much call to make special arrangements for them - even if you were interrupted, it wouldn't take up much of your working day.

exodus knife...and I think I might bring it back for 5e one day...maybe in my next newbie game.

Shiroiken · Jan 3, 2019

Rope Trick is a fine spell that works exactly as intended. It allows a safe hiding space for 1 hour, which not coincidentally is the standard rate of a Short Rest. The time taken to climb into and out of the area is incidental, and would only count as detrimental to the Short Rest by one of two types of DMs: a sadist who wants to hurt the players at every chance, and a rules lawyer who feels the need to nitpick every possible aspect. As others have mentioned, a 1 ft section of rope is all that's needed, meaning that climbing really isn't even necessary (and if so, per the rules should not require a check, unless there is a chance and consequence of failure).

As for the concept of it, it's based on the Indian Rope Trick, a magic trick popular in India in the 19th century, where a rope rises up to nothing, and the magician (or their assistant) climbs it in order to disappear. There are old accounts dating it back to the 9th century, but the details of the trick vary.