D&D 4E Which role is least important in 4E?

[Kzach]

I'd go with leader.

I'd say, in order of importance, based on how many players you have, ie. 1 player = primary importance, 2 players = primary and secondary, etc. they'd be:

Defender
Striker
Controller
Leader

Defender is paramount. If you've only got one player, you want them to be a defender. They're tough and they dish out decent damage. Marking is highly underrated too, especially for the fighter and opportunity/shift attacks. Plus they have the ability to heal themselves.

Striker's, I think, are underrated. Their damage output is essentially worth two characters in one. Killing opponents quickly means you have less opponents to deal damage to you. That's why you always get rid of mooks/minions first, right? With 4e's massive hit point pools, doing the damage of two characters makes striker a must-have in any group.

Controllers aren't just about doing damage to large amounts of foes, they're also about affecting large amounts of foes. Sleep is possibly the best most useful power in the game at 1st-level. Slowing a group of opponents alone can make the difference between finishing off two encounter groups or being overwhelmed and a TPK.

Leaders are awesome. I love warlords and clerics and I think they provide valuable services to the group. I definitely want one in any group I'm playing in. However, compared to all the other roles, they are by far the least needed. Their buffs are great, but healing comes in other forms and if you're getting hit as a striker or controller, then you're doing something wrong, so second wind is generally enough to get you by, especially if you're dispatching enemies quickly and efficiently, which is what the defender/striker/controller schtick does well.

 

[Destil]

Everyone can do damage... what's a striker do again? A little more damage? Eh. Not impressed.

 

[Victim]

Leaders are awesome. I love warlords and clerics and I think they provide valuable services to the group. I definitely want one in any group I'm playing in. However, compared to all the other roles, they are by far the least needed. Their buffs are great, but healing comes in other forms and if you're getting hit as a striker or controller, then you're doing something wrong, so second wind is generally enough to get you by, especially if you're dispatching enemies quickly and efficiently, which is what the defender/striker/controller schtick does well.

I disagree. If your strikers and controllers are doing everything "right" and not taking damage, then your per encounter healing is just the defender's second wind. That's really great. And enemies don't drop all quickly.

 

[NorthSaber]

Controller.

Our group only has three players currently, and we have two defenders (fighter and paladin) and a striker (ranger). The paladin has some healing and both the fighter (multiclass wizard) and paladin (dragonborn) have AoE minion-control abilities.

If you asked me whether we need a dedicated healer/buffer/debuffer more, or a controller to blast and hinder large numbers of enemies, I'd take the former.

When we all have healing potions and various abilities that boost our hp and defenses and healing surges etc, I might choose differently, but then we're all going to have more AoE powers too...

 

[Kzach]

I disagree. If your strikers and controllers are doing everything "right" and not taking damage, then your per encounter healing is just the defender's second wind. That's really great. And enemies don't drop all quickly.

A 'little' translates to double what other roles are capable of. In terms of damage, that's two characters for the price of one.

The longer opponents last, the greater the chance your group will die. The longer they are exposed to the randomness of the combat system, the more it benefits the enemies and harms the party. It's a pretty well known fact about dice-based RPG's.

So damage output is more important than healing.

 

[Minigiant]

The main thing is the number of enemies. Because of the Economy of Actions, the more enemies your face, the more important defense will be. If you have a party of 6, you could be facing maybe 7 non-minions. Therefore any one person could be bloodied or dropped in a turn if ganged up on. Healing won't help if you can easily lose 1/2 your HP and round. Control is needed there.

But in a small group, defense is low priority due the the number amount of potential actions. Ending the fight fast is most important due to the lower amount of tactics on your side.

 

[Shabe]

In the game i'm dming the character with the least impact seems to be the Wizard, apart from the fact that he anihalated the minions in an encounter with a flaming sphere, thing is the multiclassed fighter dragonborn is pretty much on minion wiping out duties as he can get a better position to lose off the blasts, he'll probably come into his own when he gets to wack out status effects on large number of people, i hope.
The 2nd character with the least impact is probably the striker, he averages around 12 damage while the fighter and paladin are averaging around 9. Mind you we have only played 4 sessions of KotS and are just on the verge of 2nd level.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I would guess that WotC thinks "Controller" since they only provided one of those, and they were trying to get away from having 'must have' classes!

I've only DM'd for 1st level characters so far, and they have 1 defender, 2 leaders and 2 strikers. Their battles would have gone much easier if they had a wizard as they are lacking in ranged AoE options at the moment.

It seems to me that defenders and leaders are the most necessary and controllers and strikers the most dispensible, although ideally we'd get all four basic roles in a party.

Cheers

 

[DracoSuave]

You have to remember, a striker's job isn't just doing a bit more damage.... it's also to avoid being the guy targetted, so that attacks go more towards Leaders and Defenders, who are made of sterner stuff.

This idea is based on the healing surge model. Most healing is based on the healing surge, whereas damage is a flat number.

So, let's say a character takes X damage. In reality, he's taken X/M damage, where M is his max hit points. The character is bloodied at 1/2 damage, mind you, regardless of how much X or M is. The character is out of the fight at 1/1 damage, again, regardless of how much X or M is.

Healing surges, however, heal 1/4 damage, each and every time. Every interaction between the rules and damage occurs at the ratio of damage to hitpoints, not at the number of hitpoints themselves.

What this means then, is that you as a group, want the damage going to those with higher max hit points, and abilities to give themselves temporary hitpoints (lowering the number of X). It is -always- optimal of the Fighter takes the hits over anyone else, because those healing surges will heal more hitpoints that way, and more hits of the opposition are thereby negated.

Strikers have abilities that in one way, or another, lower the chance of them being targetted and therefore, increase the chance of the Defender being smacked around. That's an -important- service to the party, as it strains less of the Leaders' resources.

 

[KarinsDad]

I have to vote Striker as least needed.

The Wizard with Scorching Burst can often attack 2 opponents per round. For example, the following scenario can often be done by the Wizard and Defender:

Wizard readies Scorching Burst

.....
.EDE.
.....

Defender attacks and then shifts back and the Wizard
booms 2 Enemies via the Target square (and often gets
to do it on the next round as well if the enemies try to
maintain flank)

..T..
.E.E.
..D..
.....

And it's not as if it's easy for the Defender to avoid flank anyway (in this example, if he shifts SW instead of S, the enemy on the right just moves around S of him), so him staying in flank might as well benefit the party.

The following happens a lot too:

..TT.
..EE.
..D..

Wizard does not need to ready, he just booms
one of the two Target squares

Another scenario:

Wizard readies Scorching Burst

.....
..E..
.DEL.
.....

After the Defender (or the Leader) attacks the flanked
Enemy he shifts and the Wizard booms the Target square

.....
.TE..
..EL.
..D..

If the Wizard attacking two opponents can do as much damage as the Striker attacking one, sure he won't drop opponents as fast since he is damaging two opponents instead of one. But combined with his control, especially at higher levels, he will lower the attacks per round of enemies which in turn will win battles quicker.

And sure, #1 and #3 here won't work against some creatures (like the Kobold DragonShield), but there are only a few creatures (maybe 3) in the MM that can do that type of thing. People are just used to it due to KotS.